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primal

RIP Doc Gonzo

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The point is that regardless of whether you are a volunteer or not, when you have an official logo attached to your name everything you say will carry more weight and will be put under a microscope. If you feel the need to frequently post strong opinions then you shouldn't be a mod because it discredits your impartiality. Constantly needing to tell people you are not an employee is also not a good look. Just lose the badge and you say what you want without pulling the devs into it.

Agreed, I don't understand what the big deal is.  They didn't take away his ability to share his opinions on the forums.  He just isn't a mod anymore. 

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Agreed, I don't understand what the big deal is.  They didn't take away his ability to share his opinions on the forums.  He just isn't a mod anymore. 

Doc got demoted for forumbaning in an area of the boards that have up until now been a safe place for SB'ers to enjoy the rampant hostility that gives them joy.

 

Doc got demoted for acting in a way that up until now has been quite normal on the boards for mods.

 

The big deal is that we have a new community head and the rules have changed unexpectedly.  The situation seems odd/unfair/weird/unexpected.

 

Not sure what is so unclear here. You may not agree and that's fine.  It's a thread to honor the Doc.  If you don't get it, move along.  One never knows when trollingwhenclueless is going to be added to the ban list.


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The Chronicles of Crowfall           The Free Lands of Azure            RIP Doc Gonzo.

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Doc got demoted for forumbaning in an area of the boards that have up until now been a safe place for SB'ers to enjoy the rampant hostility that gives them joy.

 

Doc got demoted for acting in a way that up until now has been quite normal on the boards for mods.

 

The big deal is that we have a new community head and the rules have changed unexpectedly.  The situation seems odd/unfair/weird/unexpected.

 

Not sure what is so unclear here. You may not agree and that's fine.  It's a thread to honor the Doc.  If you don't get it, move along.  One never knows when trollingwhenclueless is going to be added to the ban list.

We don't actually know specifically what caused doc to get de-modded.  We do know however that they expect their mods to act a certain way because the mods are a reflection upon the company.  It really wouldn't matter which forum it was on, if the mod is behaving in a way that does not match their vision. 

 

I don't think the rules have changed unexpectedly they are just being enforced more consistently which may take some adjusting but will overall make for a much more fair environment.  That means standards for mods are being enforced more consistently as well as standards for regular posters. 

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Well, this thread's still going well. 10/10. Good to see we're getting some post count for some of those care bear non-factors. Good for you guys.

You have no idea how much your benediction means to us. *wipes tear*


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The Chronicles of Crowfall           The Free Lands of Azure            RIP Doc Gonzo.

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Damn.  Ok, here goes.

 

I am a very laid back kind of guy.  I have owned my own business with many employees. I have been a gl, ic and many other positions in games.  I have admin'd forums, been a mod on several forums and a member of many many more.  In the forum I admin'd, I was given the nickname WoM, for Wise ole Man.

 

99.9% of the time, I post only when I think of something funny to say.  Even when I make a serious post, I put a twist of humor in it.

 

The recent events concerning Doc has raised my ire.  Injustice, unfairness, little green plastic soldiers tactics or attacks on free speech always makes me draw my sword.

 

In this case, we have MaT who is notorious for baiting, exaggerating and doing anything he can to start a fight.  Not anything anyone from SB is unfamiliar with.  Doesnt even bother us.  If he didnt act like an asshat we would think that someone stole his name.

 

We also have Doomgrin.  Someone who claims to have stolen someone elses name. Someone who has no history on these forums, but yet has managed to bring down a community icon.

 

And there is left....poor Doc.  Fair, witty, wise, humorous....etc..etc..ad nauseum.

 

 

Had I been modding that thread, I would have locked it.  Sent a pm to MaT to cool it down a notch.  Ignored the email from Doomgrin.  Sent a pm to Doc congratulating him on his ability to keep his cool.

 

No, I am not a personal friend of Doc.  I have been reading his posts for over a decade.  As far as in game, QFT did destroy one of my cities once. (then they gave it back)  But that is all the contact I have had.

 

This whole situation troubles me deeply.  Because Doc lost his Modship?  No, he will get over it.  What bothers me is the circumstances leading up to it.  It reeks. It reeks of unfairness.  It reeks of possible future nightmares. It reeks of a loss of confidence in our devs.  If they take the easy way out in this situation instead of researching the history of the participants, what is to protect us once the game is open?  Will my guild be banned because some whiny ass got his feeling of self righteousness bruised?  Will the ability to hit the report button or send an email count more ingame than the ability to control your character?  

 

This is a war game.  War is a form of politics.  Politics from previous games WILL carry over into this game.  MaTs posts in that thread are almost word for word the same posts he was making 10 years ago.  I was laughing while reading that thread.   It was like being on a pg rated Ubi thread. And they were rehashing the same old poorly made socks that has been rehashed ten thousand times.  And ten thousand and one times and it still boils down to he said, she said.

 

tl:dr(dont really know what this means)

 

Actions were taken on this situation that forebode dire future possibilities.  Those actions were wrong, in more ways than one. I fear this game may not become what I thought it could be.  Sorry, JTodd. I love you man, but this is a serious situation.

 

 

 

ps.  If this rambles some, My apologies, I like my late night brandy.

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He already said earlier he got unmodded due to belligerent communication. When a mod is consistently on the verge of openly insulting someone, even if that person is baiting, how is that in any way acceptable behavior for someone representing a company?

 

He can now endlessly engage in heated debates about events from 10 years ago with no worry about misrepresenting the devs or having his impartiality called into question. People are acting like his 'VIP' status was taken away, which completely misses the point of what being as mod is.

Edited by RolexSweep

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I feel there is no point to instigate poorly made socks, and critique the game and the devs because a mod was stripped of his powers, if you really feel that dismissal of a mod will hamper your ability to enjoy the game in the future or have hurt your feelings, you need to take some medicine or visit a shrink, or just stop being a needy custard trying to attract attention. De facto These forums ARE unfair, both mods and the posters constantly make actions and posts that can be considered controversial at very least. Docs own modding methods could be considered anything but "free speech friendly" at times. So please spare all the hypocricy and whine, what was done is done, hold no ill feelings and move over.

 

- edit. from my personal experience with doc if you started discussing decision of authorities in any way or critiquing them you'd already have a warning point and your posts removed, so consider yourself lucky you have the ability to express your opinion, and drop all this "offence on free speech" hogwash.

 

Doc Is a good guy in general yes, but all this noncence with trying to make him some kind of a holy martyr and using it to torch the devs is ridiculous.

Edited by rajah

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eh custard it, its not worth the warning point

Edited by mandalore

40 minutes ago, Andius said:

W/HoA were held up as like these mystical forces of highly skilled players with legendary theorycrafters chained to a desk in some deep dungeon holding all the arcane secrets we could use to win if only we knew them.

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eh custard it, its not worth the warning point

I beleive that what happened here with the doc and you are bringing up are two totally different aspects of community management. One is related to interpersonal conflict between a mod representing a company and a poster, the other is about managing expectations about in game mechanics. Also as a general rule you can not make conclusions based on a single observation.

 

You call them heaby handed for dismissing a mod I will call them going soft for letting you discuss this whole situation, because surely that wouldnt be possible some time ago. Just to illustrate that there is more then one possible viewing angle.

Edited by rajah

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eh custard it, its not worth the warning point

 

 Wow.  That sums it up well.   When a player now becomes more afraid of the warning point than wanting to voice their opinion there is something def different and very wrong.  I could hear the eggs shells crunching under his feet instead of the egg being thrown and watching while the yolk dripped down someones face.


Maybe it not about the happy ending. Maybe it's about the story.

RIP Doc Gonzo "to anyone...speak your mind...defend your position...be prepared for an Argument and enjoy the process of the discussion...that's all part of any good Forum experience"

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Community is what you make it.. I don't know any of the people here from any other games but i have made some people i like talking poorly made socks with and others i like to player. However i think reading, and not taking part in something does keep you from being part of the community..... I enjoy reading some peoples post ( its almost like facebook with there crying ) but again if your not down in the trenches trading blows with people your not really part of it.. 

 

+1 for a good post. ;)

 

It was Forumbaning man, that's the truth. Doomgrin is just a puppet account. I'm not reaching for my tinfoil hat but it was an obvious move to take down doc because they didn't want a QFT mod. Politics killed Doc.

 

I have a guildmate who used to be a Mod on the SBEmu forums.  This is exactly what he said.  Apparently MaT likes to bait, then troll with another account.  Over there MaT got temp bans... Here?  Doc gets slammed.  

 

 

The point is that regardless of whether you are a volunteer or not, when you have an official logo attached to your name everything you say will carry more weight and will be put under a microscope. If you feel the need to frequently post strong opinions then you shouldn't be a mod because it discredits your impartiality. Constantly needing to tell people you are not an employee is also not a good look. Just lose the badge and you say what you want without pulling the devs into it.

 

Here is MY issue.  Doc was VOCAL from day 1.  He was NOT a mod from day 1.  My point?  They took Doc on as a moderator AFTER THEY KNEW HOW VOCAL HE IS/WAS.  If they really expected him to NOT still be as vocal then they must've been smoking something... maybe it was just too many brownies?  *shrug*  What I do know is, if you don't want your mod team to have a voice, don't pick mods who have a voice.  

 

I truly do understand that they want their mods to act a specific way, and I am 100% okay with that expectation.  They just need to pick their mods more carefully.  Not everyone is like CMurder and just hushes once they get that toothpick.  (<3 C)  Like I've said before, I like our mod team.  I have no issues with any of them, and I think they are doing a great job.  Mod practices changed a lot since week 1 - and I do think that Tully/Gordon/Pann/whoeverpicksthemodteam have done a good job in their choices.  I, personally, think Doc was also a good choice and that he did a great job - but, he isn't a great choice if ya don't want ya mods to talk. :)

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Mal, a stringent and thought out recruitment process with proper planning and due dilligence requires time and thus costs money, considering the game is not making revenue yet, you can not expect ACE to put too much effort into areas that are currently secondary in importance at best.

 

People have tendency to make mistakes, especially when they are busy, realise this and live with it.

Edited by rajah

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Mal, a stringent and thought out recruitment process with proper planning and due dilligence requires time and thus costs money, considering the game is not making revenue yet, you can not expect ACE to put too much effort into areas that are currently secondary in importance at best.

 

People have tendency to make mistakes, especially when they are busy, realise this and live with it.

 

If it is going to cause issues with your company's reputation (as a lot of you seem to think it will) then you better put forth some effort.  And there shouldn't have been much effort needed to know that Doc was opinionated and stated his opinion often.  All you have to look at is a post count.  

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He already said earlier he got unmodded due to belligerent communication. When a mod is consistently on the verge of openly insulting someone, even if that person is baiting, how is that in any way acceptable behavior for someone representing a company?

 

He can now endlessly engage in heated debates about events from 10 years ago with no worry about misrepresenting the devs or having his impartiality called into question. People are acting like his 'VIP' status was taken away, which completely misses the point of what being as mod is.

Very well put.  He can still chat and debate just like he was doing before, there's just no mod status attached to it. 

 

I'd also like to add that Pann made a good point, you can debate very passionately about things without making it a mudslinging contest, ACE isn't preventing anyone from doing that. 

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If it is going to cause issues with your company's reputation (as a lot of you seem to think it will) then you better put forth some effort.  And there shouldn't have been much effort needed to know that Doc was opinionated and stated his opinion often.  All you have to look at is a post count.  

 

Not to pick on that but this is also part of what rajah told you. Time and time again ACE told us how busy and packed they were. Why should anyone expect to see the process of becoming an actual professional upstart with a following without any errors happening?

 

It's unfortunate for Doc to be the 'victim' of a necessary error to get a feeling for the needs and limits of this community but it would have happened regardless of who would have gotten shafted. Never, ever experienced a volunteer program on the internet without such drama.

Edited by Angier

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You have no idea how much your benediction means to us. *wipes tear*

Oridi is getting good in her snark.

 

+1

 

 

I love how sheen keeps ignoring everything and instead repeats himself over and over again...

That has always been his M.O.

Edited by Kell

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Not to pick on that but this is also part of what rajah told you. Time and time again ACE told us how busy and packed they were. Why should anyone expect to see the process of becoming an actual professional upstart with a following without any errors happening?

 

It's unfortunate for Doc to be the 'victim' of a necessary error to get a feeling for the needs and limits of this community but it would have happened regardless of who would have gotten shafted. Never, ever experienced a volunteer program on the internet without such drama.

 

Should check out my post in Pann's thread.  I agree to a point.  I am not saying ACE should be without error.  

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Here is MY issue.  Doc was VOCAL from day 1.  He was NOT a mod from day 1.  My point?  They took Doc on as a moderator AFTER THEY KNEW HOW VOCAL HE IS/WAS.  If they really expected him to NOT still be as vocal then they must've been smoking something... maybe it was just too many brownies?  *shrug*  What I do know is, if you don't want your mod team to have a voice, don't pick mods who have a voice.  

 

I truly do understand that they want their mods to act a specific way, and I am 100% okay with that expectation.  They just need to pick their mods more carefully.  Not everyone is like CMurder and just hushes once they get that toothpick.  (<3 C)  Like I've said before, I like our mod team.  I have no issues with any of them, and I think they are doing a great job.  Mod practices changed a lot since week 1 - and I do think that Tully/Gordon/Pann/whoeverpicksthemodteam have done a good job in their choices.  I, personally, think Doc was also a good choice and that he did a great job - but, he isn't a great choice if ya don't want ya mods to talk. :)

 

You know, I honestly think if Doc simply put a disclaimer on his sig stating all his opinions are his own and do not reflect the opinions, choices, direction, attitude or stance on "poorly made socks" and the act of flinging poo at each other.  And all his moderation choices are entirely arbitrary, fair and are not reflective of his personal stance, thus being completely free of personal bias. *shrug*  Maybe they wouldn't of had a problem, when I think about it,

 

I honestly do not know why they would, but my original opinion on the reasons they may of still stands.  It depends on what the developers expect of the conduct of their moderators;  It's their choice and their decision ultimately.


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Now in GLORIOUS 'HDvisioning60fpsblahg'


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