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jtoddcoleman

01/13/15 - Character Creation Preview

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Stylized graphics do not necessarily mean singular molds of textures. V.s. "realistic" graphics. You can have a more dark and toony type art direction while still having extreme attention to detail as well as multiple texture molds per gear/item/bodypart. Take Guild Wars 2 for example or even some single player RPG's like darksiders etc.. 

 

At the end of the day its all based on the artists and the engines.... No one artist is the same, some are influenced by others but I see Crowfalls art direction going heavily based on enviornment.. Lots of shading, lighting, filters... i.e. if you're in a dark zone the entire tone of the game changes with it... but you won't know until we see more. I just feel as though its sort of close minded to reference one person's art style based on someone else's game.

 

Guess I am close minded for making comparisons then. Also TERA was going in the right direction with graphics in my opinion, but the game sucked.  Imagine if we had those graphics with a game that was badass.  Todd can do it, he did it before.


 

Formerly known as - AmazingTacoBurito

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Love the graphics. I was worried that the game would try to hard to be realistic, but it's taking a cartoony approch which I think will make it look far better overall. I'm a bit sceptical about the amount of classes or archtypes, but I probably shouldn't say much before we know more about it. Tons of classes will be hard to balance

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Ummm, I got addicted to WoW and I was 19 (maybe 20)? And I got hooked on League of Legends at 30...granted I AM a big kid at heart, but most adults that play video games are...

 

This isn't To Catch a Predator... most people don't really care about graphics and care more about gameplay.

 

(Catch a Predator was in reference of the games kiddie baiting, in case there's any doubt of what I was referrring to)

 

Of course gameplay is most important than graphics, but "also the eye wants its part"... specifically I am not referring to the graphic quality (also however necessary), but to the style...  for example I think to a simple amatorial mod for Civilization IV: Fall from Heaven 2, or I can to mention Endless Legend or the Disciples series by Akella... games without a special good graphics but with evocative style. I can to mention also Morrowind of the Elder Scrolls series: not a good graphics, but a very evocative and original style.

 

Sorry, but my first impression about this game is a childish style and I presume a banal lore. For the gameplay I have good expectations.

 

I also throw my support behind the art style. It's cool and simple and you'll be able to pump out new assets with a bit more ease than some ridiculous over-rendered ****. There's a reason team fortress and wow stood the test of time on esthetics, and I find this not to be necessarily "cartoonish" because I dont see comical body proportions, big noses, crazy big eyes, or any  of that -- just a 2D-style representaation in 3D. Remind me more of Street Fighter 3 than WoW.

 

A good suggestive graphic style can to be also simple without the need to be "next gen" with great ultra-realistic graphics as EVE Online or Star Citizen... and without to be cartoonish.

 

Street Fighter 3 does not have humanized badgers, humanized stags or... humanized pandas. OMG, humanized fat badgers! Absolutely not a mature lore.

 

Remind me more WoW or The Chronicles of Narnia than Street Fighter 3.

 

In any case do not care about me... I see I am in the minority and I see all love cartoonish style and classic stereotyped fantasy with fat nicely badgers and elves with wow-style big ears. LoL-WoW-Torchlight style always win in large scale marketing. I prefer more mature and dark style and if possible not stereotyped lore (classic good vs evil). Games of Thrones, The Witcher and Elder Scrolls are for me good examples of evocative and not banal settings and lores.

Edited by mulkarn

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Both the character creation and art style look cool, but there are a couple immediate warning flags. Most importantly that combat utilizes RNG (Damage 15-25, Critical Hit Chance 5%) which can result in a roughly 200% damage variance (15 vs. 31.25). The more RNG factors into combat the less a players individual skill and decision making does which is incredibly frustrating for players. Designing a healthy combat system is a huge challenge so I can understand the appeal of incorporating RNG as a compensation tool, but it's lazy and not healthy for the game in the long run.

 

The second issue is that movement is an attribute which can theoretically be increased. Mobility is one of those power meters that is difficult to quantify, but its effect can be severe especially for those character types with short range spells/attacks. I was a Shadowbane player for years and loved it to death but the discrepancy in movement rates and it's harmful effect on PvP was one of its more annoying features.

 

Even though I did love Shadowbane, I couldn't go back and play it now due to the heavy use of RNG, pre-combat buffing syndrome, excessive travel times through empty wastelands and the severe impact mobility/flight had on PvP. I hope Crowfall doesn't go down this path.

Edited by fats

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If there's not already, I hope there's some lightning/shadow type damage implemented. The fire would be control of the heat, ice would be all things water and a lot of frozen water (ice :P), which is typically found in games with damage types that enhance elements of the world and such, but more diversity is necessary. It'd be cool to call upon lightning, the destructive damage type which is stereotypical, but also extremely vulnerable. It's also common to have a spiritual type school that deals with ghosts, death, shadows, and all that shady type afterlife-y death-y stuff. I'd be really downfallen if those types weren't under the scroll-down menu. As I said, a good game has diversity in damage types ;) If you have only ice and fire, you can either expect ice, or fire. Gets a bit boring tbh. When you factor in more types of damage, now things start getting fun. Especially for those of us who are biased against ice/fire, that's 3 stereotypical 5 me.


ϟhαdσwßłαdə

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Judge Judy, murican.

Wheel of fortune, murican.

 

Hockey, Canadian.

Maple syrup, Canadian

Acceptance of all types, Canadian.

 

Pfft.  On that last statement.  My grandmother was Canadian.  I know better.  Also that nice stereotype, people don't buy it.  (My grandmother has to be the nastiest old lady I ever met and that's coming from me.

 

1) I don't wear a mullet

2) Who the heck is Judge Judy

3) I am female

 

What's the issue.

 

Gasp!  You don't know Judge Judy?  NY ***** like me.  (I almost forgot that was a censored word that I already got warned once for.)  She used to be a judge in the family court system in NYC but cleared cases with such amazing speed tolerating no nonsense b.s. that 20/20 did a documentary on cut-throat style.  That aired and got people buzzing so she was offered her own court show, doing small claims.  She recruited her bailiff from the NYC courts and they've been taking no bull from idiots stupid enough to air their dirty laundry in public by throwing out their court cases for a chance to be on tee vee ever since.  God, almost 20 years now.  I love Judge Judy.  Does it show?  I bet she laughs her ass off at the pension she gets from the State of New York every month. 

Edited by blaze duskdreamer

Not quite carebear, but sort of cousin to,


meh, grumpy old lady...


Never underestimate grumpy old ladies.

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Only if you put them in loin cloths too because without that they'd still be better armored  than the norm for female characters sadly.  Could never understand the less is more mentality where female character armor is concerned in gaming. Only thing I could ever come up with is games are mainly made by males who are too some degree pervs.

 

I know this is a forum for speculation on the game and not a place a thread to talk about equal rights. So I'll be as brief as possible.

 

First off: I think that practical function can go out the window when you are talking about a game. It doesn't have to make sense. 

 

Secondly I don't understand the discrepancy between the sexes either (In games in general). I think the discrepancy is the issue because it implies a sexuality normalization. That implication can be demeaning to people who do not conform to whatever the developers and artists portray. For example: If a peice of armor looks different between male characters and female characters, that can be an issue. If man puts on a sweater and then a woman puts on that same sweater, it doesn't look much different on them. 

 

So my suggestion to the developers for this game would be to allow varying cloths styles for both male and female characters and let people choose how they wish their character to appear. Lets face it. Sex is real and we cant just ignore it. Even if everything in the game looked the same, there would still be sex involved. We wont be able to please everybody. But perhaps we can give enough options so that the players can decide how their character looks in the world, male or female.

 

If i want my female/male character to walk around in a skimpy outfit, I think that's acceptable and I don't think anybody should be able to tell me that it's not. When we don't give that option, we are sending the message that it's not allowed or not OK.

 

But I respect the decisions of the developers to do whatever makes them happy with their game (I or anybody doesn't have to like everything that's created.)

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Nice.  Thus far I like what I can see.  The art style is really nice and unique.  I'm a little concerned that all the bodytypes and facetypes will be... the same.  Buff men and hourglass women.  But... I'll reserve judgement till I see more of the actual creator.

 

I'm curious to see what the second page of the character creator is.  And will "character creator" mean you get to make your own, unique character, or are you pretty much stuck with how the base archetype looks and what you're changing is stat allotment?  Is gender/species set with archetype?  What are creation points for?  Is that for altering appearance, or altering stats?

 

Overall I'm excited to see more and will abstain from making assumptions about what I see here.

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Both the character creation and art style look cool, but there are a couple immediate warning flags. Most importantly that combat utilizes RNG (Damage 15-25, Critical Hit Chance 5%) which can result in a roughly 200% damage variance (15 vs. 31.25). The more RNG factors into combat the less a players individual skill and decision making does which is incredibly frustrating for players. Designing a healthy combat system is a huge challenge so I can understand the appeal of incorporating RNG as a compensation tool, but it's lazy and not healthy for the game in the long run.

 

The second issue is that movement is an attribute which can theoretically be increased. Mobility is one of those power meters that is difficult to quantify, but its effect can be severe especially for those character types with short range spells/attacks. I was a Shadowbane player for years and loved it to death but the discrepancy in movement rates and it's harmful effect on PvP was one of its more annoying features.

 

Even though I did love Shadowbane, I couldn't go back and play it now due to the heavy use of RNG, pre-combat buffing syndrome, excessive travel times through empty wastelands and the severe impact mobility/flight had on PvP. I hope Crowfall doesn't go down this path.

 

Good players can take into account RNG as long as it isn't an insta-kill.

 

Some players intentionally build their characters so RNG mostly flips to their favor and know how to perform if this is not the case.

 

If you like a PvP game where you can be killed anywhere, do you prepare for the "what if" of being outnumbered or are you surprised by it even though you know it's a possibility? Best to go play an arena PvP game if you don't want variability with stats or anything that people "think" is "unfair". An RPG needs active player skill through engaging gameplay AND passive player-skill through preparation.

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Pfft. On that last statement. My grandmother was Canadian. I know better. Also that nice stereotype, people don't buy it. (My grandmother has to be the nastiest old lady I ever met and that's coming from me.

 

 

Gasp! You don't know Judge Judy? NY ***** like me. (I almost forgot that was a censored word that I already got warned once for.) She used to be a judge in the family court system in NYC but cleared cases with such amazing speed tolerating no nonsense b.s. that 20/20 did a documentary on cut-throat style. That aired and got people buzzing so she was offered her own court show, doing small claims. She recruited her bailiff from the NYC courts and they've been taking no bull from idiots stupid enough to air their dirty laundry in public by throwing out their court cases for a chance to be on tee vee ever since. God, almost 20 years now. I love Judge Judy. Does it show? I bet she laughs her ass off at the pension she gets from the State of New York every month.

Blasphemy, grammas are never not nice.

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Pfft.  On that last statement.  My grandmother was Canadian.  I know better.  Also that nice stereotype, people don't buy it.  (My grandmother has to be the nastiest old lady I ever met and that's coming from me.

 

 

Gasp!  You don't know Judge Judy?  NY ***** like me.  (I almost forgot that was a censored word that I already got warned once for.)  She used to be a judge in the family court system in NYC but cleared cases with such amazing speed tolerating no nonsense b.s. that 20/20 did a documentary on cut-throat style.  That aired and got people buzzing so she was offered her own court show, doing small claims.  She recruited her bailiff from the NYC courts and they've been taking no bull from idiots stupid enough to air their dirty laundry in public by throwing out their court cases for a chance to be on tee vee ever since.  God, almost 20 years now.  I love Judge Judy.  Does it show?  I bet she laughs her ass off at the pension she gets from the State of New York every month. 

 

I know who she is, I was stating that I don't care who she is.  Since tensions are high around here, I will follow that by stating it's no offense to you, she's just not my...as you put it, "cup of tea".  But yes, I'm sure she's laughing all the way to the bank.

 

To put this back on topic:  I"m hoping that if we scroll down, we'll see more animal types to choose from.  Badger might be cool if he could travel underground.  The deer is very interesting...I think it would be cool to gore someone with my antlers.  But I'm still hoping for a wolf.  I would not even know how to contain myself if there was a wolf.

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Hopefully there will be no gender locks or pre-made characters with little to no or no customization at all available... A big no-no or instant quit when it comes to MMORPG are that there are never enough(if any) customization. Can't stress that enough, Body(height, weight, chest size)/Hair/Facial Hair and other options like piercings or tattoos... The more customization a game will have the better. 

Edited by óðinn

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Trust me, I appreciate female characters that are armored appropriately and it is something I am always focused on. But not every female needs full plate armor. Maybe I should add some guys without shirts to balance it out? /evilgrin

Alright alright, so I'm going to come into this discussion right now, and talk about what I think about this topic. Everyone's been talking about how they would want a female character coming out in Crowfall to be presented. Aside from most things, I HAVE heard that the developers of Crowfall say they will be different, and I can assure you form my stand point, I do want female characters to look presentable and not like they just came from a "gentleman's club" where they work. Some examples of what to not follow in the footsteps of would be a couple of games that I know. If I recall, Scarlet Blade has a feature where you can roam their MMO in full nudity. That being said, I don't see the necessity of that in a combat game, and actually I'll talk a moment to go ahead and stop the people thinking "oh, a game is supposed to be about fantasy," and that's nice, but keep it in the genre. The game is a combat game, not a super happy fun time game, there is literally no need for that option, or for the skimpy outfits you would have the option to wear in that game.

 

Now, I'd like to draw your attention to Tera Rising. Tera Rising, in my own experience playing this game for the past year and a half, has some aiming mechanics for where you shoot your arrow, fireballs, or where you swing your sword/axe to, but lest we forget the skimpy outfits for female characters, sexual innuendo, and other such things because what combat game isn't complete without that sort of thing, huh? am I right?? no, no that's not what I want in a MMO combat game is to fight giant monsters next to a girl wearing armor that barely covers one of her legs and shows half her torso. One outfit they made looks like they stuck a picture they had of it originally in KidPix and swirled it around to look like that. Tera has it's ups of a beautiful atmosphere and an aiming mechanic that I had yet to see in an MMO before, but the skimpiness and sexual innuendo drew in the wrong kind of crowd and made the community of the game out to be mostly teenage boys who like to make female characters just to buy them all the outfits they can wear, and what's really the point in itemizing a female character?

 

Trust me, I appreciate female characters that are armored appropriately and it is something I am always focused on. But not every female needs full plate armor. Maybe I should add some guys without shirts to balance it out? /evilgrin

 

Back on the subject of the quote I've taken...  I don't need to be able to go shirtless, cause why would I want to? I want that heavy armor while I'm fighting for my life so I know a female knight would as well. Yes, not every woman or class needs full plate armor, but that does not mean you take an archer or a mage and give them short skirts and half-body covering leather armor. Archers are going to want a full vest and studded chaps when they are shooting arrows, and mages are going to want to wear something light, like a robe, so they can move to cast spells and put distance between them and the full plated knight running after them.

 

And as I had the pleasure to hear one of my female friends say, "Dreary old robes are clearly a perfect example of some fool trying to make a fashion statement that will cost them their life, but I prefer fighting with pants and a shirt on at least, since the bikini look is pretty much equivalent way I see it. There are options between tripping-over-my-dress and wearing-the-bare-minimum-to-technically-not-be-naked. And to the person who made the mobility point... yea, I can understand having less restriction and agree to an extent, but what purpose does having your chest mostly exposed serve from a combat standpoint..?" and that's just another point made by another human being who wants to present themselves to be that, a human being, not some item to play dress up with. Thanks for reading!

 

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