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Belaz

Let's talk Critical Hits

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With the current focus on combat and the fact that I have been playing some old school Everquest on Project 1999 I came to realize how much I like the idea that critical hits are pretty rare things, so when they happen it feels like a pretty cool xmas present.  It has more of a true DnD feel to it rather than some of the crap out there now that has you sporting a 50% or higher crit rate.  In those games it feels like if I am not critting I am not doing anything, rather than the feeling of joy when I just dropped a crit bomb for a nice little bonus to my hit.  

 

What are your thoughts?  Do you want to see a small crit chance so they are much rarer things or do you like high crit chances so it happens all the time?  Do you want to even the field and take out the RNG and straight up remove crits from the game making it even more skill based?  

 

Personally I would like to see crits set at a very low chance with very few ways to improve it and those would be very small improvements.  I wouldn't lose any sleep if ACE just decided to F crits and let the best man win!

 

 

 

 

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For me it depends what the time to kill is.  For low TTK crits are not needed and can really skew the fight when you get a lucky RNG and one or two shot someone. With a higher TTK then I kind of enjoy them being there.

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crits get to be a pita when your damage is so dependent on them you have to pile on +crit gear to compete

 

i remember doing that for rogue in wow back in the day and it sucked

 

if they're an occasional, lucky hit that's cool, but if you NEED crits for your damage output then they lose all that "oomph" and are pointless


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if they're an occasional, lucky hit that's cool, but if you NEED crits for your damage output then they lose all that "oomph" and are pointless

 

That's a good point when it comes to balancing crit% and crit damage.  I think a model where the crits are rare but bigger is more rewarding than having them be pretty much your standard hit and just called a crit.

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I have seen a lot of talk about whether or not to included RNG in the game but I think the goal that they have in mind here is usually a skill based system. I think that if they stuck with no critical hits but weapon damage variations that went from high to low(Steel sword 19-25 damage) that would be more exceptable. Then you could have weapon crafters that are more skilled creating more consistent weapons(Sharp Steel Sword 22-25 damage) or even raising the damage modifier(Master Crafted Steel Sword 24-28 damage).

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I have seen a lot of talk about whether or not to included RNG in the game but I think the goal that they have in mind here is usually a skill based system. I think that if they stuck with no critical hits but weapon damage variations that went from high to low(Steel sword 19-25 damage) that would be more exceptable. Then you could have weapon crafters that are more skilled creating more consistent weapons(Sharp Steel Sword 22-25 damage) or even raising the damage modifier(Master Crafted Steel Sword 24-28 damage).

 

I could get behind a system like this.  Really with no healers you won't need burst damage to have a chance of killing someone.  This would also make crafting and the quality of your crafted good more significant. 

 

Don't get me wrong having burst options can be a ton of fun and I am hoping that every archetype built for damage has at least one skill shot that will allow them a chance at some big boom boom numbers.  I just don't love the idea of the randomness of critical hits from a behind the scenes system.  

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With the current focus on combat and the fact that I have been playing some old school Everquest on Project 1999 I came to realize how much I like the idea that critical hits are pretty rare things, so when they happen it feels like a pretty cool xmas present.  It has more of a true DnD feel to it rather than some of the crap out there now that has you sporting a 50% or higher crit rate.  In those games it feels like if I am not critting I am not doing anything, rather than the feeling of joy when I just dropped a crit bomb for a nice little bonus to my hit.  

 

What are your thoughts?  Do you want to see a small crit chance so they are much rarer things or do you like high crit chances so it happens all the time?  Do you want to even the field and take out the RNG and straight up remove crits from the game making it even more skill based?  

 

Personally I would like to see crits set at a very low chance with very few ways to improve it and those would be very small improvements.  I wouldn't lose any sleep if ACE just decided to F crits and let the best man win!

Your crit chance should depend on your build

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I could get behind a system like this.  Really with no healers you won't need burst damage to have a chance of killing someone.  This would also make crafting and the quality of your crafted good more significant. 

 

Don't get me wrong having burst options can be a ton of fun and I am hoping that every archetype built for damage has at least one skill shot that will allow them a chance at some big boom boom numbers.  I just don't love the idea of the randomness of critical hits from a behind the scenes system.  

 

I think that having it like that is great for the crafters and makes the high end of the damage spectrum your "critical hit" so to speak. Then you will have people going all Hattori Hanzo with it and making the perfect sword that does 29-30 damage and everyone will want his swords.

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Your crit chance should depend on your build

 

I'd rather that not be the case. Damage modifiers, speed modifier sure, but no matter how much you train you can't improve luck. Luck isn't a skill. If you sit there and roll a dice 100 times you don't get better at rolling twenties.

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Critical hits are a simplified alternative to locational damage, designed for games in which you can't actually aim your attacks. I say no to crits, yes to locational damage. But we already have a crit percentage stat...

 

Eh, maybe they'll remove it. Fingers crossed.

Edited by txteclipse

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I'd rather that not be the case. Damage modifiers, speed modifier sure, but no matter how much you train you can't improve luck. Luck isn't a skill. If you sit there and roll a dice 100 times you don't get better at rolling twenties.

Exactly, which is why I support comboed crits.

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Critical hits are a simplified alternative to locational damage, designed for games in which you can't actually aim your attacks. I say no to crits, yes to locational damage. But we already have a crit percentage stat...

 

Eh, maybe they'll remove it. Fingers crossed.

 

Your right I did see that in a promo image but they have also said that they are going a different direction with combat than they were during the kickstarter in that Combat interview they did recently. 

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Exactly, which is why I support comboed crits.

 

I suppose having a skill that gives you a chance to randomly do more damage would be a cool idea. Also locational damage doesn't have to be so hard if they make it based on your position(e.i. being behind someone is a crit, flanking 50% chance of a crit).

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No chance, a skill called "focus" that you can use once every two or five minutes. It allows you to activate your next skill at double potency. Debuff lasts longer, heals for more, damages double... what have you.

 

In a big fight, your timing and which skill you buff will matter. It becomes a tactical play, rather than a chance play.

Edited by Adall

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I would rather see as much RNG taken out of the game as possible when it comes to damage rolls and crits.

 

I think the calculation of your stats plus weapon damage, subtracting their armour + defensive stats should make you hit for a specific number - and you should hit for this much each time you hit that person, assuming nothing changes.

 

Darkfall had a system where if you hit someone in the back with a weapon/spell, you did 50% (?) more damage. This was known as a crit at the time. Something like this would be good, as if you can attack someone from behind you should be rewarded, it removes RNG and makes people think about their positioning a bit more.

 

Generally RNG should have no place in PvP focused games. When RNG is involved in pvp, one party comes away from the battle disgruntled off. As a very basic example, think of Mad Bomber in Hearthstone. Each time that's played, one person gets annoyed by the results. Bad game design IMO, down with RNG.

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crits get to be a pita when your damage is so dependent on them you have to pile on +crit gear to compete

 

i remember doing that for rogue in wow back in the day and it sucked

 

if they're an occasional, lucky hit that's cool, but if you NEED crits for your damage output then they lose all that "oomph" and are pointless

Yeah, I think they often don't get properly factored into damage output. Kinda like evasion and defense.

 

I also think it could be pretty great to see criticals often granting some additional effect. Like a sword critical causing a bleed, or a magic bolt critical causing blindness or something. Instead of criticals purely equaling critical damage.


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Yeah, I think they often don't get properly factored into damage output. Kinda like evasion and defense.

 

I also think it could be pretty great to see criticals often granting some additional effect. Like a sword critical causing a bleed, or a magic bolt critical causing blindness or something. Instead of criticals purely equaling critical damage.

I could get behind that idea.  Crits causing CCs and other special attacks/effects instead of extra damage.  


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