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Combat: Finding the fun - Official discussion thread

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Rather like the keep layout. Seems like you almost got your work cut out for you. As for the keep layout, I take it your wanting players to jump over it?

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Will there be "Meurtrières" provided in walls ?

 

Meurtrières  => Windows, vertical slot in a fortification wall to throw projectiles or shoot

attackers
 
Sorry for my english, I'm French ^^

 

We call them "murder holes" when they face the inside areas, and "arrow slits" when they face outside.

And the tooth-like projections  on top of the walls are merlons.


Honestly, you are the type of person that is much to competitive, has zero compassion for other people and think you are better than everyone else. You likely love to troll people on a day to day bases to get others angry and laugh about it. You make playing any online game unfun for everyone else.  -Kuroaka

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To the point of the amount innovation one has to spend, I'm honestly ok with the team not reinventing the wheel here.

It's perfectly fine to take already well established ideas and mechanics of other combat systems because, well we already know what good combat feels like.

The significant majority of games are combat games, so there is no shortage of material to draw from.

 

Just fine mechanics that you like, and adapt them to suit your needs.  I'd rather innovation be spend on other core mechanics that otherwise don't get a lot of innovation.  Cough "Crafting" cough.. cough "crafting sucks" cough... I'm sorry I had an anvil in my throat.

 

 

But my point being is that something doesn't have to be innovative to be fun... if the innovation has already been done before.  And if is hasn't been done before.. then maybe then it's time to innovate.

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For me, the simpler a game, the more fun it is. Before the "hardcore" crowd starts jumping down my throat, let me explain with some examples.

 

Your Tetris example is a good place to start: the premise is simple and novel, move falling blocks to make a line and make it disappear. Rules are sumple and concise, yet mastery of these simple rules is what makes the game fulfilling and fun. The use of a simple premise and concise rulesets or mechanics can be found in many old-school games - pacman (eat dots and fruits, avoid ghosts); sonic and mario (get to the end as fast as you can while collecting points and power ups); legend of zelda (use items to beat dungeons and survive). All these mechanics were deceptively simple and concise, summed up in a handful of words, but addicting and fun because of it, with mastery of the game's mechanics acting as a gamers "progression".

 

Combat in today's games is somewhat similar in concept: use techniques to deplete health/result in conditions that defeat your opponent. Many games use health bars and attack buttons to accomplish this. Yet there are innovative ways to do combat as well. Super Smash Bros is a prime example of simple fun combat: use techniques to ring out opponents, more damage means more danger. Simple, challenging, with HUGE payoffs for mastery.

 

Games today try to overcomplicate things, ESPECIALLY in mmo's. WoW is a good example of how overcomplicating things can ruin a game/combat. WoW used to be much simpler than it is today, rewarding players for mastering customizations and combining techniques/spells. As WoW has aged though, they keep adding more and more abilities and mechanics, leading to hotbar bloat, becoming indecipherable except only to a few. At that point, WoW stopped being "fun" and became "work." WoW has other issues, but for now, just sticking with the simple stuff.

 

On the other hand, the Souls Series has fantastic combat that is immersive and again simple. Each weapon has their own attack style and gameplay with mastery of these weapons rewarding players. Other mechanics complimented this, but the core combat gameplay never changed, staying simple to execute, but challenging, difficult, and fun to master. Skyrim followed an even simpler style and is still one of the most played games today. There were ways to modify combat, but the premise and range of abilities stayed very concise and simple, without needing a ton of modification, such as additional effects or flashy additional mechanics. So in terms of keeping combat fun amd accessible, as my 4th teacher told me long ago: KEEP IT SIMPLE, STUPID

Edited by RKNM

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I have to admit Im really excited to see the results of the this testing, dont forget testers the forums want all the gray shaded details!

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Design of outer walls looks nice , im making a suggestion for the ramp and stairs .

Its to chunky and takes more space , you can add pillars as support so there is space under,we might be able to put storage boxes with items for siege defense there , there is more possibilities to use that space.


TSCCC-member

TheHateCrew- core member

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We call them "murder holes" when they face the inside areas, and "arrow slits" when they face outside.

And the tooth-like projections  on top of the walls are merlons.

 

 

Thank you BurgundytheRed :)

My english vocabulary is enriched.

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Design of outer walls looks nice , im making a suggestion for the ramp and stairs .

Its to chunky and takes more space , you can add pillars as support so there is space under,we might be able to put storage boxes with items for siege defense there , there is more possibilities to use that space.

Did you read the article?

That part of things being just grey boxes to test with and later adding details?


 

This game looks like a larger scale version of marvel heroes so far with forts.  - nephiral marts 7 2015

 

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That part of things being just grey boxes to test with and later adding details?

 

... actually, in this case, the details in question (turning the area under the ramp into useable space) would materially affect the play experience, so IF it is something we want to consider, then we should include it in the testing sooner rather than later.  Adjusting the grey box right now to use supports instead of a single block would be cheap -- much cheaper then it would be to change later, after we've spent a month modelling and texturing the stairs out of stone.

 

I'll mention the idea to Jon, it's interesting  -- but only worth pursuing if we felt there would be enough space and clearance to make the space useful and fun (walking in a tight area can be annoying if it is too confined, due to avatar and camera collision.)  But if the space would be useable, or if it would improve flow through the zone then opening up the area beneath might make a lot of sense.

 

Todd


J Todd Coleman

ArtCraft Entertainment, Inc.

Follow us on Twitter @CrowfallGame | Like us on Facebook

[Rules of Conduct]

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Btw, some great questions in this thread.  I'll talk to Jon and we'll cook up another update with more details on how we are building this stronghold, and our assumptions about scale and flow.  

 

If you have other questions, feel free to post them here!

 

Todd

ACE


J Todd Coleman

ArtCraft Entertainment, Inc.

Follow us on Twitter @CrowfallGame | Like us on Facebook

[Rules of Conduct]

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... actually, in this case, the details in question (turning the area under the ramp into useable space) would materially affect the play experience, so IF it is something we want to consider, then we should include it in the testing sooner rather than later.  Adjusting the grey box right now to use supports instead of a single block would be cheap -- much cheaper then it would be to change later, after we've spent a month modelling and texturing the stairs out of stone.

 

I'll mention the idea to Jon, it's interesting  -- but only worth pursuing if we felt there would be enough space and clearance to make the space useful and fun (walking in a tight area can be annoying if it is too confined, due to avatar and camera collision.)  But if the space would be useable, or if it would improve flow through the zone then opening up the area beneath might make a lot of sense.

 

Todd

 

Well, useable space means I can put explosives there, right? Then, yes, you need to do this. :)


I'm in this for the Experience, not the XP.

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Well, useable space means I can put explosives there, right? Then, yes, you need to do this. :)

 

if you have explosives in a voxelized world, you can MAKE useable space. ;p

 

Todd

ACE

 

p.s. I'm not confirming explosives.  

p.p.s. I'm also not NOT confirming explosives.


J Todd Coleman

ArtCraft Entertainment, Inc.

Follow us on Twitter @CrowfallGame | Like us on Facebook

[Rules of Conduct]

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Btw, some great questions in this thread.  I'll talk to Jon and we'll cook up another update with more details on how we are building this stronghold, and our assumptions about scale and flow.  

 

If you have other questions, feel free to post them here!

 

Todd

ACE

It might be even more helpful for scale if when you show these models in the future to have say a model character in the scene somewhere, even if its just another box that represents the height of an average PC.  

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