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malant

Shadowbane is the road to hell.

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I'll start with the part I didn't quote - I can't speak to his other videos, as I haven't seen them.

 

On the part I do quote, you're missing the key, in my opinion. The point of confrontational evangelism (and I love evangelism, but I'm not a big fan of the style) is to quickly make people realize that if they don't change, then they will be condemned.

 

Again, I'm not a big fan of the style, but the point is still a valid one. If someone you like is about to blindly walk off a cliff, do you not warn them?

That's an excellent rebuke, and I commend you. However, I would counter that walking off a cliff is a clear and definitive danger in which you'd be negligent not to warn, where as videogames pathing a road to hell is a subjective, even by biblical interpretation, of the judger, in itself contradictory to the concept of not attempting to speak FOR god/cast judgement oneself. Holrom is passing his own judgement that we are going to hell, not making us aware of a definitive risk, and denying us our free will to both interpret and/or act by declaring its absoluteness. Furthermore, there is a host of negative emotion attached to "you're going to hell" in comparison to "you're walking off a cliff" that is not ignorable. To ignore it, regardless of how definitive HE may think it is, is rude/cruel. I do not walk into a room and say "You have cancer, you're going to die," albeit true, because I'm not an unpleasant person.

Edited by fuggeroffuggington

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Fugger of Fuggington - Shadowbane

SkippyBojangle - PS4

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That's an excellent rebuke, and I commend you. However, I would counter that walking off a cliff is a clear and definitive danger in which you'd be negligent not to warn, where as videogames pathing a road to hell is a subjective, even by biblical interpretation, of the judger, in itself contradictory to the concept of not attempting to speak FOR god/cast judgement oneself. Holrom is passing his own judgement that we are going to hell, not making us aware of a definitive risk, and denying us our free will to both interpret and/or act by declaring its absoluteness. Furthermore, there is a host of negative emotion attached to "you're going to hell" in comparison to "you're walking off a cliff" that is not ignorable. To ignore it, regardless of how definitive HE may think it is, is rude/cruel. I do not walk into a room and say "You have cancer, you're going to die," albeit true, because I'm not an unpleasant person.

You just nailed why I have an issue with confrontational evangelism. The best evangelism comes from a state of truly caring for the person you are talking to, and when you confront someone, regardless of how much you actually do care, that aspect gets lost when the other person gets their dander up.

 

With that said, to a believer, either you are going to heaven or you are going to hell. It's a pretty binary thing. I definitely don't see the issue with someone taking their time to let someone know they can make it to heaven. :)


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The problem is that he assumes people care to be warned about his personal opinions, especially with out knowing really who is at the other end of their online personality.  I can't possibly take someone serious who can't even control themselves with video game addiction.  He's just replacing shadowbane with another activity that garnishes the same mental benifit.

Edited by facerip

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You just nailed why I have an issue with confrontational evangelism. The best evangelism comes from a state of truly caring for the person you are talking to, and when you confront someone, regardless of how much you actually do care, that aspect gets lost when the other person gets their dander up.

 

With that said, to a believer, either you are going to heaven or you are going to hell. It's a pretty binary thing. I definitely don't see the issue with someone taking their time to let someone know they can make it to heaven. :)

 

To your last sentence, see my last sentence in previous paragraph.


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Fugger of Fuggington - Shadowbane

SkippyBojangle - PS4

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I got what you were saying, but there's a key item lacking with your analogy. You can't just decide to be cancer free if someone tells you about it. You can decide to be saved at any time. I'm not saying that choosing salvation is an easy road - far from it - but the two are definitely not similar.

 

I'm good with agreeing to disagree, as I think we're going to devolve in our responses from here, and I'd much prefer to keep it cordial. I'm definitely open to discussing further in PMs if you would like.


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You're missing the point. It's about tact and respecting a person's free will. I could change the analogy to a chemo discussion for instance.

 

You don't pass judgement on someone based on your interpretation by telling them their choice is taking them to hell. That makes you an ahole. That's not Christian. Holrom doesn't speak for his God, or maybe he does, but then he's totally off the boat. But I'm digressing -- it's about tact. If he honestly believes the choice is leading to someone's eternal damnation, he can let them know, offer a helping hand -- but there's a human way to do that, to express concern and initiate discussion, and a not OK way - so tell someone their choice in a fairly benign and entirely modern activity is sending them to hell. He chose the latter masked in a tone of consideration. He is in no way expressing concern or opening dialogue, he is casting judgement. Period.


and you know I don't take discussions to PM. I'm a gladiator.

Edited by fuggeroffuggington

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Fugger of Fuggington - Shadowbane

SkippyBojangle - PS4

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I got what you were saying, but there's a key item lacking with your analogy. You can't just decide to be cancer free if someone tells you about it. You can decide to be saved at any time. I'm not saying that choosing salvation is an easy road - far from it - but the two are definitely not similar.

 

I'm good with agreeing to disagree, as I think we're going to devolve in our responses from here, and I'd much prefer to keep it cordial. I'm definitely open to discussing further in PMs if you would like.

 

"you can decide to be saved at any time"

 

Is that for real?  You are equating actual visual and scientific existing things to a faith based idea.

 

Even using the term, "choosing salvation" is awful.

 

Religious assumptions about other people's prerogatives is the key indicator that you aren't a rank 1 human and rely on mysticism to guide your moral compass.

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You just nailed...

You had me at nailed.

 

Nothing like the feel of a good hammer in your hand... and a handful of nails in the other. Makes one wanna give planks. ;)

 

Seriously, though, for every "You're going to Hell!" that was directed at me, a corresponding "Lead the way!" was sure to be heard. Hehe.

 

Good to see everyone agreeing to disagree, as usual and as per Shadowbane custom.

 

*tips her helm*


"Signals, Sound off Plates and Greaves! Line up! Prepare to advance!"

- Saying things a Centaur Legionnaire likes to hear.

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You just nailed why I have an issue with confrontational evangelism. The best evangelism comes from a state of truly caring for the person you are talking to, and when you confront someone, regardless of how much you actually do care, that aspect gets lost when the other person gets their dander up.

 

With that said, to a believer, either you are going to heaven or you are going to hell. It's a pretty binary thing. I definitely don't see the issue with someone taking their time to let someone know they can make it to heaven. :)

 

I highly recommend you read A History of God by Karen Armstrong if you have not already. It is an excellent launching point to understand the historical origins of the big three monotheistic religions. I do not think anyone that has actually studied theology sufficiently would view entry into heaven so simplistically. If you are going to devote your life to honoring a faith, you should understand where that faith came from, and how it has been fashioned by men throughout the ages. 


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Not to add some levity, but upon skimming through that video.... I just picture Holrom, bible in hand, yelling STACK UNDER THE TEXT! STACK UNDER THE TEXT! as he leads his born again KGB converts down a road (to heaven, hell or somewhere more corporeal).

 

Of course in my minds eye his words also appeared in capitals above his head...

 

Dunno, the thought was definitely worth a laugh or two for me.

Edited by angelmar

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and you know I don't take discussions to PM. I'm a gladiator.

Therein lies the reason why I'm just going to agree to disagree.

 

Look, we all know from the SB boards that it's nigh on impossible to convince someone of something, even when you can produce screenshots and videos showing their position to be full of fallacy. I have no desire to get into a session of confrontational evangelism here - as you eloquently put in the portion of you post I didn't quote, when you do so, you resemble a certain posterior hole that emits bodily refuse. I have no wish to resemble that particular body area, so I will refrain from mounting a legitimate defense of Faith in this forum. Unfortunately, the majority of folks who would participate in such a discussion would do so only to exalt themselves intellectually over any person who chooses a different path. I won't say that your posts personally would be that way - just that such a thread would attract mostly haters, as the previous posters in this thread have already shown.

 

The last time this exact video came up on these forums, I made an open offer to discuss via PM with anyone who truly wants to discuss faith. I will reiterate it here. Last time, only Doc Gonzo took me up, and we had a great (and civil!) discussion ranging over several months. I won't say any minds were changed, to think we both learned more - if nothing else, we learned more about one another.


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As I walked up the gates of heaven, St. Peter looked down upon me and said, "Naw bruh. To much Shadowbane. Down you go. Pwnt!"


You are so incredibly helpful, CYT. I don't know how I ever managed to do anything before we met. I was just bumbling my way through life, all lost-like. Thank you. My blessing cup runneth over.

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Therein lies the reason why I'm just going to agree to disagree.

 

Look, we all know from the SB boards that it's nigh on impossible to convince someone of something, even when you can produce screenshots and videos showing their position to be full of fallacy. I have no desire to get into a session of confrontational evangelism here - as you eloquently put in the portion of you post I didn't quote, when you do so, you resemble a certain posterior hole that emits bodily refuse. I have no wish to resemble that particular body area, so I will refrain from mounting a legitimate defense of Faith in this forum. Unfortunately, the majority of folks who would participate in such a discussion would do so only to exalt themselves intellectually over any person who chooses a different path. I won't say that your posts personally would be that way - just that such a thread would attract mostly haters, as the previous posters in this thread have already shown.

 

The last time this exact video came up on these forums, I made an open offer to discuss via PM with anyone who truly wants to discuss faith. I will reiterate it here. Last time, only Doc Gonzo took me up, and we had a great (and civil!) discussion ranging over several months. I won't say any minds were changed, to think we both learned more - if nothing else, we learned more about one another.

 

It's almost like you believe that discussions of faith should be kept private instead of, you know, making a video about it.

Edited by halethrain

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It's almost like you believe that discussions of faith should be kept private, instead of you know, making a video about it.

Only when intelligence overcomes ignorance.


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"Agelmar is King of the Hypocrites and Ruler of the Kingdom of Hypocrytia"

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There is so much truth in the above quote!!! LOL

 

 

As far as the video.  That's an old one.  We had many lulz at the expense of that video.  Although I vehemently dissagree with just about 99.999% of what he says, it still took some stones to put himself out there like that.

I don't think it took bravery to put this out there.  This isn't about bravery, courage, balls or machismo; this is about being a moron.  He was weak to allow the game to dictate his entire life in the first place.  Addicts in recovery aren't brave, they are getting their poorly made socks together like they are supposed to in the first place.  This is hypocrisy and religious zealotry at its finest. 


40 minutes ago, Andius said:

W/HoA were held up as like these mystical forces of highly skilled players with legendary theorycrafters chained to a desk in some deep dungeon holding all the arcane secrets we could use to win if only we knew them.

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As I walked up the gates of heaven, St. Peter looked down upon me and said, "Naw bruh. To much Shadowbane. Down you go. Pwnt!"

A rock was later dropped on Heaven... walls breached and buildings aflame... the littering of haloed-skulls on sticks, everywhere... glorious!

 

*has a dream*


"Signals, Sound off Plates and Greaves! Line up! Prepare to advance!"

- Saying things a Centaur Legionnaire likes to hear.

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It's almost like you believe that discussions of faith should be kept private instead of, you know, making a video about it.

It's much easier to have a discussion in a smaller group. As I said, I'm not a fan of the style of evangelism. It doesn't mean I think evangelizing is wrong.

 

I am a man of faith. If anyone wants to discuss it, I am more than happy to do so. My evangelistic style is to lay it out there and let people who are interested in discussion know there's someone whom they can talk to about it.


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It's much easier to have a discussion in a smaller group. As I said, I'm not a fan of the style of evangelism. It doesn't mean I think evangelizing is wrong.

 

I am a man of faith. If anyone wants to discuss it, I am more than happy to do so. My evangelistic style is to lay it out there and let people who are interested in discussion know there's someone whom they can talk to about it.

 

As long as you understand and accept that evangelism of any other faith is just as acceptable; atheism and satanism inclusive of that acceptance. 


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