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01/15/15 - Templar's, Champion's and a Cryptic Tree?


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It's been said on multiple occasions that they won't be.

Please quote where you heard that from. Pic or it never happened. Because from everything I've read, it is yet to be announced officially, but it's certainly gearing towards it. And I am on the forums a lot.

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Hey gang,   A few interesting items for you today!     Continuing the exploration of our art style, we wanted to show you how an idea (in this case, a character) makes the jump from "2D illustration"

The first 2 images are pretty straight-forward. A character and a battle. The last one is the juicy one though. That one I'm guessing is showing the different factions or powers you can have, the spec

Combining the crest tree and the background art on the entire site suggests that a major theme of this game will be a struggle between the forces of day and night. Crows come in as a carrion feeder ne

I agree with that 100%. Now, I want to know the exact intricate details of how/why the Amazons procreate only females. Because they come from somewhere. I want some good Lore, with no holes in it.

 

I think by SB lore they were the males were kept as slaves or something for procreation. They existed but were very minor in their society or something like that. I may also be thinking of something else and that isn't related to SB at all.

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It's been said on multiple occasions that they won't be.

 

No, it hasn't. Again, people are projecting their personal preferences and hopes, against all available evidence.

 

Here, heres a devtracker, http://www.crowscall.com/devtracker/

 

Please post the evidence that gender locked archtypes has been debunked.

 

Spoiler alert: It hasn't been.

 

Hey gang,

 

Re: "gender locking" -- i.e. archetypes being locked to a particular gender -- let me say this: 

 

We will answer this question in the coming weeks.  

I don't think you will be disappointed with our answer.

 

Now, back to the game of rampant speculation!

 

Todd

ACE

Edited by flex

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Templar's, Champion's and a Cryptic Tree?         
 
Todd
ACE

 

 

Hey Todd, I gotta be the guy to do it. It's just my way...

What exactly belongs to the Templar and Champion referenced in this thread title?

 

Flame on.

Edited by bairloch

I'm in this for the Experience, not the XP.

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She looks supper vulnerable and weak without the thigh armor that is in the left picture. Also the elbow pauldron is missing.

Concept art to game model - 80%

Polish it please.

EDIT: The lower body parts is where it's at. You didn't do a very good job, I mean the artist who did the concept did, but the 3d modeler did not.

Was it that hard to give her the same trousers and boots as in the concept. It isn't a realism issue either they were widely used: 

il_fullxfull.620468838_sf51.jpg

Edited by thisismyemail
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Combining the crest tree and the background art on the entire site suggests that a major theme of this game will be a struggle between the forces of day and night. Crows come in as a carrion feeder neutral to the struggle, suggesting large battles that leave a lot of dead on the battleground like the title of "A Feast for Crows." The names on the crests are strongly reminiscent of Norse mythology as well. In Norse mythology, day and night were actually personified as gods.

 

It seems to me these crests are representative of a sort of pantheon in the game world. Rather than being factional, certain classes or races may favor and take power from certain crests and their respective godheads. Fire mages and templars favor daylight while assassins and cold mages favor night. An additional argument against solid factions is the middle column of crests that suggest a balance between night and day. Near the roots, there are the rodent dudes that could individually favor the powers of either night or day. Going up the center there are:

 

D'Orion - Hunters love taking horns as a prize. "Orion" is a constellation named after the huntsman god Orion. This suggests to me a ranger-type deity that is accustomed to hunting by starlight or has some association with celestial powers.

 

Gaea - "Gaia" is the earth-mother and the tree with roots represents grounding and druidic powers. Mother also suggests nurturing and thus healing powers, often associated with druidism as well.

 

Kronos - This pretty obviously has something to do with time. Chronos is also represented as the man turning the Zodiac Wheel, so the center column of crests suggests having some power over the two sides.

 

Valkyn - The Valkyrs worshiped Odin, who was the Allfather of the gods in Norse mythology, so it makes sense that this should be on top, the largest and the most powerful.

 

The opposed sides may just be different ways of doing things instead of factions. Daylight suggests doing things out in the open and honorably like a knight might, night suggests stealth and cunning. The cybelle unicorn instills it's worshipers with speed while the spider is a rallying symbol for those skilled in assassination.

 

All I know is J. Todd Coleman seems to like trees in his lore quite a bit considering the Tree of Life in Shadowbane and this tree taking center-stage in a lot of the art across the site.

 

I love this, I think exactly the same! Maybe we can add this to the story:

"In the Book of Genesis, the tree of life is first described in Genesis 2:9 as being planted with the tree of the knowledge of good and evil "in the midst of the Garden of Eden". In Genesis 3:24 cherubim guard the way to the tree of life at the east end of the Garden. The tree of life has become the subject of much debate as to whether or not the tree of the knowledge of good and evil is the same tree."

To me, its pointing that during the process of learning we are all capable for doing good and evil.

Crows were also messengers (in GoT) and mostly known as messengers  of death after the battle.

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I am really drawn to Gaea, have been since I first saw that tree.  I hope that individual characters are able to choose which crest to be loyal to and it is not something that has to be voted on and is for an entire guild.  I think guilds are going to be important but still want a lot of choice individually.

 

It is wonderful that we get another hint just 2 days after the first one!  More, more more!

Maria Lightheart

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Please quote where you heard that from. Pic or it never happened. Because from everything I've read, it is yet to be announced officially, but it's certainly gearing towards it. And I am on the forums a lot.

We know you are on the forums a lot, hard not to notice.

 

Thought I saw it being said, if not then oh well.

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I like the templar concept art, but I do not like how she looks in 3d model form. The textures just look terrible, especially her face (wow, vacant and lifeless much?), and everything is too matte, drab and smooth; looks like an amiibo left out in the sun too long, or some other kids toy, because her face looks painted on rather than properly modeled. It reminds me of old WoW models in that sense. Not that she looks like an actual in-game model of an amiibo mind you, super smash bros wii u models actually look better than this. Landmark/EQN and Wildstar (and WoW's new models) have much more personality to their models, and GW2 just looks more detailed and "better" overall despite those models also looking kind of vacant, just saiyan.

 

The templar model, like the knight archetype model, is desaturated and lifeless, while the concept art is rich and lively. I wish the in-game assets looked more like the concept art. I'm now afraid of what the environments are going to look like, and I wonder if Artcraft is going for a "works on everything including your smart phone" engine-from-2009 approach. I mean that may be a smart design decision in the end, or perhaps not, I don't know, but as for appearances, yikes. Not the worst of course, but certainly not even close to the best (especially in 2015/16/17 when this game releases).

 

There is a pretty simple fix for this though, just work on the textures, especially the resolution, and the lighting. I'm sure the textures/lighting will improve later on, but here is some early constructive criticism for you devs to consider, if you care about this one person's opinion at all that is. I should say that I'd still play the game without hesitation even if the graphics never improved, as long as the gameplay was appealing to me -- I just wouldn't enjoy the game as much as I would have if the graphics were satisfying. I can't comment on the gameplay yet because they haven't given us enough info, so until then I'll keep harping on the graphics.

 

As for the last two items, one looks to be confirming duels of some kind in a coliseum environment. Meh. Don't care that much personally, not my thing, but its a fine feature to have for those that do enjoy it. The last picture with all of the emblems organized within a tree structure looks like either a Deity list that we will have to choose an alignment from (sigh), or maybe guild factions or in-game prebuilt factions. I'm going with deity factions, the names sound like god names. If they are a pantheon of gods, this sort of thing has been done many times already in fantasy games and mmos, and I'm not a fan. So far I'm not seeing how this game stretches the bounds of whats already been done to death in fantasy mmos forever, but maybe Artcraft is starting with the commonplace fantasy tropes first and saving the unique stuff for later.   

Edited by emralled

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I think you could make an argument for the center crests being a basis for the day and night aspects of themselves on the left and right branches just below themselves. It also goes along with the knowledge of good and evil branching from the tree theme as well. For example:

 

The base of the tree might represent "base" natures, namely desire. Desire and wealth go together, so rodent races could be representative of those seeking wealth. Little badger dudes are like the neutral bankers of the world. I feel like underground rodent dudes are themed as being rich with vaults underground in fiction. I can't cite anything though...

 

The D'Orion elkhorns could represent animalistic nature. The serpent and the crow on other side are natural enemies. Not a lot on this one I can come up with.

 

The two sides to the Gaea tree are similar. Both are branched. The Maeve squid has many branched tentacles. "Maeve" in irish is "one who intoxicates" so the water imagery as well as the flipping of the image relate to that. The Yaga crest is also a tree, but without daylight it is barren and dying. Barrenness also goes along with the "gaea" mother theme. Baba Yaga is a  matriarchal witch-like figure in Eastern European folkore too, so it could represent witchcraft though Baba Yaga was ambiguously good or evil at times. I think that ambiguousness is represented well throughout the tree image here.

 

The Kronos in the middle crest has aspects of quickness with the unicorn and patience with the spider. It is easy to see how these opposing traits could play out in chraracters.

 

Finally the valkyn dragon-looking creature manifests in a winged lion on day and a dark cat on the night side. Could be power on the left and stealth on the right, not a ton to go on there.

 

Again though, this all suggests to me that hard factions are not a part of the game since the crests are so dependent upon each other and interrelated.

Edited by ciliano

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D'Orion - Hunters love taking horns as a prize. "Orion" is a constellation named after the huntsman god Orion. This suggests to me a ranger-type deity that is accustomed to hunting by starlight or has some association with celestial powers.

Also in French the word "De" means of and if De is put before a word like Orion with the first letter being a vowel then De becomes D'.

 

Meaning that D'Orion could be "Of Orion" like the children of Orion or something like that.

 

I don't know though so I'm most likely 100% wrong.

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They did not say this what so ever. They said..

 

 

 

Which is essentially a non-answer, which is fine, everything before the "big" reveal is all gravy info, but lets not let our wishful thinking and preferences allow for conclusions not grounded in reality. The chances of MOBA presets, gender and race locked Avatars at this point (based upon the limited evidence available) is more likely than not, unfortunately.

 

That last line...is everyone missing that last line?

 

"Re: "gender locking" -- i.e. archetypes being locked to a particular gender -- let me say this: 

 

We will answer this question in the coming weeks.  

I don't think you will be disappointed with our answer."

 

If people here are saying, in big numbers, that they don't want MOBA, how is that a non answer?

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That last line...is everyone missing that last line?

 

"Re: "gender locking" -- i.e. archetypes being locked to a particular gender -- let me say this: 

 

We will answer this question in the coming weeks.  

I don't think you will be disappointed with our answer."

 

If people here are saying, in big numbers, that they don't want MOBA, how is that a non answer?

Because you have no idea what they mean. No one but them does. Which is why we are playing the wait and see game. Quoting cryptic dev posts is what they want anyway, for that wild speculation. And to throw us off the scent. 

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Because you have no idea what they mean. No one but them does. Which is why we are playing the wait and see game. Quoting cryptic dev posts is what they want anyway, for that wild speculation. And to throw us off the scent. 

 

When you put in in context with the posts that were made about gender lock BEFORE he came on and say that, then I still question how you could think that's a non answer.  CONTEXT matters.

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Rajah came up with a great answer to part of the MOBA question. The knight is dual-wielding in the picture. Sword and board in the character creation shot.

 

We have weapon swapping. That's a start.

I'm in this for the Experience, not the XP.

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That last line...is everyone missing that last line?

 

"Re: "gender locking" -- i.e. archetypes being locked to a particular gender -- let me say this: 

 

We will answer this question in the coming weeks.  

I don't think you will be disappointed with our answer."

 

If people here are saying, in big numbers, that they don't want MOBA, how is that a non answer?

 

Because these design decisions were made before the anti-MOBA sentiment was raised on the board. They were conceptualized 1-2 years ago.

 

MOBAs are popular and thus making MOBA design pricipals a core component of CrowFall (As they're creeping into other modern MMOs in development such as Everquest Next) makes financial sense. Its very possible they designed CF with that in mind, and are currently saying "Oh ****, they don't like it" in the wake of community response, and are crafting responses to deal with the negitive reaction going forward. 

 

Saying that archtypes are NOT genderlocked is so noncontroversial that I don't see them simply coming out and saying "No guys, all classes can be either gender" to stem negitive community reaction... unless that was not the case, the noncommital answer leans towards a more controversial answer i.e. gender locked MOBA archtypes ala LOL and Smite.

 

Just because they said "and you won't be disappointed in our answer" doesn't mean it won't actually disappoint people nor does that mean the answer will reflect community preference.

 

 

Rajah came up with a great answer to part of the MOBA question. The knight is dual-wielding in the picture. Sword and board in the character creation shot.

 

We have weapon swapping. That's a start.

 

I wouldn't bet on concept art being reflective of the final produce. Its as likely as not, but I wouldn't look to that as evidence of anything.

Edited by flex

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