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Urahara

Combat: No phake physics -- Weather?

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Hello Crowfall fellows,

 

when I just ran through Guild Wars 2 and noticed how it was raining, but it felt just like a poor overlay on screen, and i was remembering the articel about physics on the Crowfall page, some things came to my mind.

1. Will the rain in Crowfall feel really authentic?

2. Will there be a dynamic weather System like in the Witcher 3.

3. Will there be real physics in weather system too, with every raindrop having a mass?

4. Would raindrops falling onto a roof go realistic each their own way?

5. Would an Ice Mage casting an Ice spell be able to turn raindrops into ice?

6. Would there be big storms and nature catastrophes possible which alter the terrain just like players can do?

7. Would that make real wind physics possible?

8. Could i use the real wind and gravity physics to construct an airship?

Well thats is all bit over the top i guess, but i just wanted to mention it.

 

This is then maybe something to be expected for a Next Next-Gen-MMO  :)

 

I was watching a video about a guy thinking about these things after Everquest Next info was revealed. Since both games (Everquest Next and Crowfall) got the same engine, i think some of it would be possible maybe

This is the video, to give him credits for these ideas

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sxj4vZw9gi0

 

Did someone see the rain in Everquest Next Landmark already? When i played it last time, there was no rain

Edited by Urahara

After EverQuest Next is gone, its Star Citizen for me.

 

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I don't think the raindrops would have mass because it would probably bring the server to its knees if it had to account for thousands of drops as objects that you could then assign physics values

 

I think the weather is something that's often overlooked as purely cosmetic but there's always been a lot of gameplay potential as well and I think we'll see weather in CF having more impact than your average mmorpg. It certainly has the potential to do so. We already know you can run on water and ice and the physics will feel different.

 

There's always an after release SG 

Edited by oberon

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I kind of want to face roll the keyboard and go ayy lmao...but.

 

Ok. Fine.

 

Weather physics systems count too. You win. Devs 0 you 1.

I know myself that this would be too heavy for todays technology.

I was just giving ideas, if you dont know what that means, Thats why i said its going to be something for Next Next-MMO-RPG maybe.

I just felt untouched by the rain in other MMORPG like Guild wars 2. And wanted to state that i would love to see here in this direction a big step forward.

Because it really makes you feel much more emerged if the world is reacting and dynamic a bit.

A dynamic weather System like in the Witcher 3 makes a game feel much more authentic.

In the Witcher 3 even the NPC react according to the weather, and dont go working on the fields in the middle of a storm.

I just wouldnt want a rain overlay on screen like in other MMORPG anymore.

 

I thought of something else too. Crafting will be a big thing in game right?

So for crafting you need energy in real life right?

Where you get that energy in game from? A blacksmith needs heat, will he has to gather ressources for that, to get a fire burning? Or will there just be a forge you can turn on and off like a button?

And I really love windmills  <3

So in a dynamic weather system there could be a fake wind. And when the system says, ok now is the wind this and that strong you get this and that much energy from your windmill. And for solar energy there could be some kind of magic/alchemic technology that fits in the settng. Like the Asura technology in Guild Wars 2.

This would make the world feel much more alive and authentic.

So when it rains you get low solar energy but more wind energy for example.

That would fit very good with the scavenging idea of crowfall as well I think.

Edited by Urahara

After EverQuest Next is gone, its Star Citizen for me.

 

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3. Will there be real physics in weather system too, with every raindrop having a mass?

 

 

My custard sides. What would the point of this even be? Completely hog all of your computing resources for no particular reason.

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Real physics doesn't necessarily mean everything will run better with it, something like wind interference and increased weight when wet might be interesting, but it would be more effective to do artificially.

 

I'm hoping some weather features are present on Frostweaver and Dryad. Like wind manipulation on Frostweaver and water manipulation on Dryad.

 

Even though lightning has been stated as a damage type, I've yet to see any indication of it in any of the characters. It would be cool if none of the archetypes actually produced lightning, as it's not necessary for every kind of damage to be part of PvP. Lightning has often been portrayed as Divine, so it could be a rare occurrence in the weather or on certain monsters.


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Why would you have increased weight when it's raining? I think the fairly obvious change they could make it to decrease friction.

cause we are not all running around butt naked like you?!

 

well i think its gonna be easy to identify you in game then

no offense against nudist lifeway btw

Edited by Urahara

After EverQuest Next is gone, its Star Citizen for me.

 

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So you're saying you'd implement this feature just to have it make an inconsequential stat change to cloth-users? Doesn't really seem like there's a point.

Edited by kairus

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Noone said that.

What people posting in this thread are saying is, if I would have to describe it with my own words, that they want a more immersive, accurate feeling when playing.

Today the (MMO) world is just a nice to look at thing, where all you can do is jump, cast fight spells and press virtual buttons, and thats it. Thats all of your spectrum of activity and action in this world. Maybe some poor made rain screenoverlay all 6 min somewhere. Its all totally static and just buttonpressing, Forge on/off buttons if at all.

They want a more interactive world, they want more freedom and possibilities to interact with the world and other player or NPC.

One way could be a authentic, dynamic weather system like in the Witcher 3.

It could affect Crafting too like described above. That would be one possibiity.

Everquest Next is thinking of such ways too. And for a Next Gen MMORPG in 2017 that would be absolutely standard and a Must Have for me, if i should take this game serious.

 

Ice spells for example, could have a different animation when it is raining for example. Such things, you know?

You dont have to be able to turn falling raindrops into ice already, thats something for a next next-gen-game.

Edited by Urahara

After EverQuest Next is gone, its Star Citizen for me.

 

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It would be nice to see some small changes with weather. For example, a stealth character will be easily noticed when it's raining and harder to notice when it's night. 

 

However, beyond this point, I don't think it's worth implementing physics to the weather. As one oberon stated, I don't think the server will be able to handle a physic weather.

 

Offline video games can handle this kind of feature but not MMO games.


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If you ask me, your suggestion is on too small a scale. What point is there to have a changed animation if it doesn't do something? And if it does something, what should it do? I don't see how that change is relevant to real/fake physics.

 

To the person above me, why would a stealth character be more easily noticed? Personally I hope they don't handle stealth like every MMO and just have disappearing and reappearing characters, and instead actually have stealth rely on hiding behind poorly made socks and not making noise. Rain would maybe increase the sound of footsteps (the sound of rain would cover it a fair bit though, I'd assume), but decrease the odds of you being found visually. You could even have different "levels" of rain. So if it rains harder, there's more rain noise to cover up the footsteps, and whatever else might change from that.

 

In my opinion, if we're going to have a good weather system, it should be on a large scale. If you have an outpost on the south side of the map and your camp to the north is planning an invasion on an enemy stronghold, and a player from the south outpost tells you that there's a rainstorm headed north, you should be able to do something with that information. Let's also say there's an item that can be crafted by blacksmiths onto boots to give them +Friction and reduced friction reduction in rain. Then you equip your teammates/raiders with these items and wait for the rainstorm to hit the stronghold you want to assault. If the enemy team is way more likely to fall down after being hit than your team it should be an easy win. Or if you don't want a straight up fight, you can send in sneaky characters who won't be seen from far away thanks to the rain and sneak into the castle (iirc one character can tunnel under walls). 

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I think having severe weather cause some physical effects would be amazing.  Like drop a tornado and throw players around like cupcakes  :lol:

 

It would really enhance immersion.  Plus severe weather in games is just awesome.  Check out the hurricane level in Left 4 Dead 2 sometime!

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To the person above me, why would a stealth character be more easily noticed? Personally I hope they don't handle stealth like every MMO and just have disappearing and reappearing characters, and instead actually have stealth rely on hiding behind poorly made socks and not making noise. Rain would maybe increase the sound of footsteps (the sound of rain would cover it a fair bit though, I'd assume), but decrease the odds of you being found visually. You could even have different "levels" of rain. So if it rains harder, there's more rain noise to cover up the footsteps, and whatever else might change from that.

 

 

You somewhat answered the questions... When I was talking about stealth I didn't mean someone invisible, but rather someone camouflaged. Water drops falling down in the stealth character would make it easier to notice.


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I don't think it would be worth the Dev's time to implement relatively complicated systems like rain with mass (just why??) or tornadoes (cue rage, QQ and sudden power shifts). I can see weather making changes to certain player stats, though. Someone mentioned increased friction in rain- I think increased friction in swamps would be more appropriate. It would be neat to see rain cycle including dry spells. When it's raining, lighting damage could become significantly more effective, and during a drought (lasting, say, a few actual weeks) fire could become slightly more effective (burn down all the crops, anyone?)


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I don't think it would be worth the Dev's time to implement relatively complicated systems like rain with mass (just why??) or tornadoes (cue rage, QQ and sudden power shifts). I can see weather making changes to certain player stats, though. Someone mentioned increased friction in rain- I think increased friction in swamps would be more appropriate. It would be neat to see rain cycle including dry spells. When it's raining, lighting damage could become significantly more effective, and during a drought (lasting, say, a few actual weeks) fire could become slightly more effective (burn down all the crops, anyone?)

 

I actually said increased friction whilst wearing an item that is specifically made to increase friction. Decreased friction in rain, compensate with that item, being the tl;dr of my post.

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