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aparks

Make Mobs Drop USE-ABLE Loot

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I just have a different mindset I suppose from you all.

 

The only word of Warning I have is to never follow someone blindly and I feel like a lot of you are doing that with these devs. It will most likely end in your guy's disappointment in them even if the game comes out pretty close to what you and the devs thought it would. If this game is 90% PvP than I'm all down for that and if crafting is cheap because crafter want their zerg guild to win than I'm cool with that. 

 

But I would be will to bet real money crafting will be more of a grind than your all expecting, pve will be more on the forefront than your all thinking, and their will be a lot of open world not being used up do to not enough pvp hotspots due to the lack of pve related loots. 

 

If the game comes out like the most of you feel it will, I'm guessing this game will be like a larger scale pvp arena game with destructible landscape/buildings. Which can be very fun early on, but we humans have a very short attention span and a new game will pop up that is more open world sandboxy!

 

With that said I hope I really love this game and do hope the devs and all of us can shape this game into something that will last.

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I'd prefer if animals dropped absolutely nothing, when they die, you'd have a carcass, with every material they are composed of, and be able to acquire only what you can carry and what your carving skill could access.

 

Also, any edible creature should yield food, a necessary yet accessible resource.

Edited by bahamutkaiser

a52d4a0d-044f-44ff-8a10-ccc31bfa2d87.jpg          Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes... Than if they're upset, they'll be a mile away, and barefoot :P

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Tired of the world of warcraft, man-up, and go play a pve game comments.

 

Read the entire thread before you guys shoot out rude comments.

 

I've never played wow or theme park games.  I only play the hardest core pvp games (full loot, open world, no safe zones, fps aim player skills not tab target or aoe/cone handicap targeting systems)

 

At the same time PvE adds depth to any mmo and so this thread was to create an alternate way to get items in order to get into the pvping faster than waiting on crafters to make the good stuff.

 

I'm sorry the majority of you don't like my idea, but no need to be rude dicks and spout out of the mouth about stuff you don't know about me.

 

Never did I say I want to grind on mobs more than pvp.

 

Never did I say I want crafters to be useless.

 

I would buy and trade crafted items because I believe they should be better than mob drop items.

 

And I would PvP way more than anything else.

Than this game is not for you mate. The majority of these skills for melee will be cones, AoEs, and directional movement. Not direct single location attacks. Even ranged play regarding mages is proving to be rather freely granting of AoEs. 


"Lawful Good does not always mean Lawful Nice."

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Not even sure why this is even a suggestion when Ace has clearly stated time, and time again... that mobs will have little to no drops because Crowfall isn't about farming mobs for loot drops.  <_<


> Suddenly, a Nyt appears in the discussion...

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They've said something about monsters dropping coin I think, that's why it's a suggestion. Yes, it isn't about farming mobs in the traditional way, but killing a boar for instance should drop something in regards to meat and bones which can be used to feed you character (to heal?) and to craft with. This isn't farming, but being able to use things in the world to craft other things.

 

By the way, there's nothing wrong with making a suggestion, you don't need to be a negative Nancy about it; just agree or disagree and say why, instead of criticizing the thread/post or the person who made the it. 

Edited by zero2none

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They've said something about monsters dropping coin I think, that's why it's a suggestion. Yes, it isn't about farming mobs in the traditional way, but killing a boar for instance should drop something in regards to meat and bones which can be used to feed you character (to heal?) and to craft with. This isn't farming, but being able to use things in the world to craft other things.

 

By the way, there's nothing wrong with making a suggestion, you don't need to be a negative Nancy about it; just agree or disagree and say why, instead of criticizing the thread/post or the person who made the it. 

 

W/e possible drops... even if a few coins... will be very, very small and not worth farming for.  Once you add value to mob drops, they become a farm-able PvE mob, which is totally against what Ace has already mentioned against.  So, yes, because it goes against the core vision, which has been reinforced countless times, the suggestion was invalid before it was posted.  I'm not being "negative nancy", that's just reality.  It's like suggesting a baby-back ribs recipe to a vegan restaurant. 


> Suddenly, a Nyt appears in the discussion...

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W/e possible drops... even if a few coins... will be very, very small and not worth farming for.  Once you add value to mob drops, they become a farm-able PvE mob, which is totally against what Ace has already mentioned against.  So, yes, because it goes against the core vision, which has been reinforced countless times, the suggestion was invalid before it was posted.  I'm not being "negative nancy", that's just reality.  It's like suggesting a baby-back ribs recipe to a vegan restaurant. 

 

Well I have to argue that they have to give purpose and value to these mobs, if not what's the point of implementing them in the first place. I honestly, don't see what's wrong with "hunting" animals/monsters for food and bones for instance. I don't expect it to drop a new shiny sword for me, but some meat would be useful. Yes they said no to farming mobs in the traditional MMO way; sitting there and killing them over and over for hours, but they never said anything against hunting mobs for resources, especially if the mobs take a long time to spawn or are finite in numbers. (I could be wrong, but I haven't read about it any where).

 

I keep seeing this mentioned in almost every suggestion that is slightly about PvE, "against the core vision", why are people so offended over a suggestion that might not even be considered by Ace. What's wrong with sharing ideas, even if not about a PvP aspect?

Edited by zero2none

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We haven't seen what they have plans for cooking... but every game that has cooking will have gathering that includes meat from animals.  But, this is really common sense now and doesn't really need a thread for.  Ace has far more experience in how to implement all of that.

 

As for the "monster camps" (for example a zombie infestation), they represent current occupants at a POI, which players will need to first clear out.  They're also useful in a strategic/tactical sense in that you could leverage them against your enemy.

 

There are far more useful reasons that the NPC environment exists... which doesn't involve farming them for drops.


> Suddenly, a Nyt appears in the discussion...

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We haven't seen what they have plans for cooking... but every game that has cooking will have gathering that includes meat from animals.  But, this is really common sense now and doesn't really need a thread for.  Ace has far more experience in how to implement all of that.

 

As for the "monster camps" (for example a zombie infestation), they represent current occupants at a POI, which players will need to first clear out.  They're also useful in a strategic/tactical sense in that you could leverage them against your enemy.

 

There are far more useful reasons that the NPC environment exists... which doesn't involve farming them for drops.

 

Common yes, but why shouldn't it be discussed by the people funding the game?

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We haven't seen what they have plans for cooking... but every game that has cooking will have gathering that includes meat from animals.  But, this is really common sense now and doesn't really need a thread for.  Ace has far more experience in how to implement all of that.

 

As for the "monster camps" (for example a zombie infestation), they represent current occupants at a POI, which players will need to first clear out.  They're also useful in a strategic/tactical sense in that you could leverage them against your enemy.

 

There are far more useful reasons that the NPC environment exists... which doesn't involve farming them for drops.

 

Let me again try to clarify for the umpteenth time.

 

Many games like Mortal Online have the fully player crafted system meaning that wild life only drops meat, rawhide, bones, teeth, horns, fur, leather, etc.

 

If Crowfall becomes an actual MMO like Mortal than I can see this being a major fail to economy since it's been done in other games and has failed. People get bored because not enough PvP hotspots. Because in mortal the monsters don't really drop much at all and people just don't leave their keeps and just wait for PvP or if they do leave they go pick on the closest neighbor, never going across the map to fight others.

 

However this thread was never meant for WILD LIFE.

 

It was meant for zombies, skeletons, Minotaurs, etc.

 

If your going to have them in a game, why not make them worth killing other than an EMPTY obstacle in your way that gets very tiresome of having to kill every time you see them knowing they don't drop crap. Than people wonder why they are even in the game.

 

The point to the thread was that these actual mobs, NOT wild life, should drop items that they use when killed. So besides the obvious bones and corpse flesh, they should have chances of dropping the armor and weapons and other goodies they may have. Obviously I don't expect these items to be better than crafted items. But it would add more hotspots especially since there is a Salvaging system in Crow Fall.

 

And before you say "THIS IS A PVP GAME, NOT PVE FOCUS".  Yes I know and like that about this game. But if your going to have mobs in the game make them drop actual useful crap or just don't have them in the game. 

 

* Now re-read the thread with this knowledge (mobs should drop items they use to fight us) (this would lead to more pvp hotspots) (mobs than become more than just an empty shell with no reason) (crafters can salvage these items) (pvpers can get lesser quality items fast for initial pvp)

Edited by aparks

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Let me again try to clarify for the umpteenth time.

 

Many games like Mortal Online have the fully player crafted system meaning that wild life only drops meat, rawhide, bones, teeth, horns, fur, leather, etc.

 

If Crowfall becomes an actual MMO like Mortal than I can see this being a major fail to economy since it's been done in other games and has failed. People get bored because not enough PvP hotspots. Because in mortal the monsters don't really drop much at all and people just don't leave their keeps and just wait for PvP or if they do leave they go pick on the closest neighbor, never going across the map to fight others.

 

However this thread was never meant for WILD LIFE.

 

It was meant for zombies, skeletons, Minotaurs, etc.

 

If your going to have them in a game, why not make them worth killing other than an EMPTY obstacle in your way that gets very tiresome of having to kill every time you see them knowing they don't drop crap. Than people wonder why they are even in the game.

 

The point to the thread was that these actual mobs, NOT wild life, should drop items that they use when killed. So besides the obvious bones and corpse flesh, they should have chances of dropping the armor and weapons and other goodies they may have. Obviously I don't expect these items to be better than crafted items. But it would add more hotspots especially since there is a Salvaging system in Crow Fall.

 

And before you say "THIS IS A PVP GAME, NOT PVE FOCUS".  Yes I know and like that about this game. But if your going to have mobs in the game make them drop actual useful crap or just don't have them in the game. 

Your opinion.   

 

Per the faq:

 

THIS SOUNDS LIKE THERE IS LOTS OF PLAYER-VERSUS-PLAYER FIGHTING, WHAT ABOUT MONSTERS (PLAYER-VERSUS-ENVIRONMENT)?

 

There will be monsters in Crowfall – lots of them – but they are intended to raise the general “threat level” of the game, not to be the primary focus.

Crowfall will not have any instanced PvE dungeons and raids, for instance. The Worlds WILL be crawling with monsters and former inhabitants of the Dying Worlds, however.

Players will often need to fight NPC monsters near resource nodes, gain access to points of interest, scavenge for food and equipment, and often to simply survive. Many of these creatures are powerful enough that they will be very challenging to defeat – even for groups players working together.

Some activities will require players to seek out monsters – some recipes will require reagents that can only be found by defeating certain monsters, or require the use of rare Thralls (“ghosts” NPCs that must be captured) to bind into an enchantment. Also, remember that the monsters will also become more deadly as Winter approaches, and the Hunger bleeds the warmth from each World.

 

The monsters , mobs are there to increase the threat.  They drop rare reagents etc, supposedly, to connect the game to the crafting system, thus the "economy game"  IF they dropped "goodies" as you suggest, then there would be more of a chance for players that dislike the "crafting" aspect to by pass crafting and even purchasing from crafters. Even when crafted items were better.  I know I would.  There would be more of a chance for players to just seek out mobs for the drops and attempt to make that the game.   IF ACE is trying to make crafting important and form an interdependence between PvP'er and crafters, what you suggest would not help foster that interdependence.  

Edited by ellie

Maybe it not about the happy ending. Maybe it's about the story.

RIP Doc Gonzo "to anyone...speak your mind...defend your position...be prepared for an Argument and enjoy the process of the discussion...that's all part of any good Forum experience"

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"Players will often need to fight NPC monsters near resource nodes, gain access to points of interest, scavenge for food and equipment, and often to simply survive."

 

I wonder what they meant by that - either offering equipment drops from mobs or it just sounded like a good addition to the text when they wrote it.

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"Players will often need to fight NPC monsters near resource nodes, gain access to points of interest, scavenge for food and equipment, and often to simply survive."

 

I wonder what they meant by that - either offering equipment drops from mobs or it just sounded like a good addition to the text when they wrote it.

 

 

So I don't see why my thread is soo unliked!

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"Players will often need to fight NPC monsters near resource nodes, gain access to points of interest, scavenge for food and equipment, and often to simply survive."

 

I wonder what they meant by that - either offering equipment drops from mobs or it just sounded like a good addition to the text when they wrote it.

 

Personally, it seems like either a typo, or they're contradicting themselves and the stance they set way back in KS.


> Suddenly, a Nyt appears in the discussion...

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So I don't see why my thread is soo unliked!

 

Even if ACE does it, that doesn't mean people will like it! :D

 

Personally, it seems like either a typo, or they're contradicting themselves and the stance they set way back in KS.

 

It could be either at this point.  They shared a lot of "Vision", but the facts will continue to adjust as they develop the game and identify needs.  If there aren't enough organic ways for players to consistently get gear for some reason, then maybe mob drops could be a thing.

 

But, they seemed much more adamant that mob grinding wasn't going to be useful than that one sentence.  Good find though!

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I think the most likely interpretation of that phrase is as "scavenge for components to use in equipment".


Official "Bad Person" of Crowfall

"I think 1/3rd of my postcount is telling people that we aren't turning into a PvE / casual / broad audience game." -

Tully

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So I don't see why my thread is soo unliked!

 

Nobody likes your thread because your asking for something that was clearly described not to be in the game and accepted by most of the participants from the beginning. A lot of the early teaser stuff pointed out the depth of crafting and need to rely on player economy in this game, as well as Eve references, which are only related to the economic features. This is one of those hard cornerstones of the game your challenging, it's not some will nil nob to alter.

 

The only reason mobs should be dropping gold or even partial equipment is if their humanoid mobs like zombies or goblins, if you have a problem with the difficulty of creating gear from raw resources... there are a dozen other features to alter in order to change the difficulties expected, this isn't one of those things that should or must change in order to succeed.


a52d4a0d-044f-44ff-8a10-ccc31bfa2d87.jpg          Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes... Than if they're upset, they'll be a mile away, and barefoot :P

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It's quite possible that whatever equipment that does drop, will be junk.... between no armor and lowest crafted armor.  That would honor everything in the FAQ and mentioned so far.  Sure, it'll be "usable"... although, not worth farming for.


> Suddenly, a Nyt appears in the discussion...

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It's quite possible that whatever equipment that does drop, will be junk.... between no armor and lowest crafted armor.  That would honor everything in the FAQ and mentioned so far.  Sure, it'll be "usable"... although, not worth farming for.

 

I agree, the goals of the devs afaik are to eliminate the grind for progression and equipment, to strengthen the relation between players with the crafting loop and to reduce the cost of development by making the ratio systems / content higher.

 

Mobs that drop basic gears and coins do not threaten any of those goals imo.

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I personally don't mind mobs dropping loot, when it makes sense.  So a zombie attacking me with a beat up crappy club, could drop a beat up crappy club. I don't want a boss mob who drops a unique magical sword of omgwtfpwnalage though.

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