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budkin

First Look: Confessor Powers - Official discussion thread

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And yet people who have played the game, develop games and know a lot more than you are confident in trying this... But hey, everyone's an expert right?

Can you really blame people? These days it seems like 80-90% of developers have absolutely no clue what they are doing when developing their games.


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It's ok not to like long CC durations but it's tough to know if it's even appropriate to be "more conservative" in this game without actually testing any real gameplay which we won't be doing for quite some time.

 

 

Right. But there's always a line to draw or a starting point to be selected, based on a higher level design principle. The feedback here isn't about the nitty gritty, it's just about saying "hey, let's talk about crowd control. It's obvious some of us prefer shorter durations than those proposed here". In turn, this discussion helps ACE find a good starting point before they get to the point where they're re-designing or tweaking dozens or hundreds of powers at once because they decide to re-vamp crowd control durations.

 

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When you're in a massive battle and get targeted by 10+ people... You still going to complain? This will separate good from bad players... We like that in a skill based game.

If you are in a massive battle and get "targeted" by 10+ people, you should die.


I'm in this for the Experience, not the XP.

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When you're in a massive battle and get targeted by 10+ people... You still going to complain? This will separate good from bad players... We like that in a skill based game.

Agree. I think we need to think in terms of larger scale PvP when thinking about how these abilities will work. Too often I think people see numbers and abilities and think in 1v1 terms. We also need to realize those abilities need to be tuned for small medium and large scale combat.

 

 

If you are in a massive battle and get "targeted" by 10+ people, you should die.

Most times sure, but nothing wrong with having an escape to avoid that once in awhile, IMO.

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"If we find it is too difficult to play ranged, we have a few systems we may need to add or augment, like ‘sticky’ targets, ranged assist or some manner of soft locking system. We aren’t quite sure what the right mix will be yet, but we feel comfortable that we’ll eventually find a solution that works well."

 

Please don't jump to this too quickly... get a large group of testers in before you determine if it is too difficult.  I honestly believe modern gamers are pretty decent at aiming... and that yes it should be harder to aim vs people who know how to make themselves hard to hit through moving and utilizing movement abilities correctly. 

 

Edit:  Also when you add aim assistance type stuff you start feeling like a hybrid action combat game, not a true action combat game, and it's a very quick turnoff for a lot of pvpers.  That's why GW2 never developed a very strong pvp scene, it actually has a negative impact on a gamer's mentality when he is teased with action combat and it is taken away with aim assistance. 

Edited by VIKINGNAIL

Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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I'm happy for the feedback, and I will make sure Blair jumps onto the thread to read it, I just don't want you to walk away with incorrect assumptions based on poor information.  Next time, I'll make sure we provide less specifics, especially when those specifics aren't helpful, anyway.

 

Todd

ACE

 

What it seems that has focused the fire... get it?.... of the community is a lack of perspective that all of these skills have to start somewhere.  Get them into a general range of functionality and then unleash the players onto the system.  What has been stated in 3 pages here is just an atom of the universe of backlash that will come when people actually get into the game.

 

I personally like the "This is our starting point" information that you reference as it gives people stuff to talk about.  On like... podcasts and stuff.

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If you are in a massive battle and get "targeted" by 10+ people, you should die.

And when you have no way to combat focus fire it means no one ever wants to engage and start a fight so you have hour long stand offs... Not a great idea

 

 

...Next time, I'll make sure we provide less specifics, especially when those specifics aren't helpful, anyway.

 

Todd

ACE

JTC I completely understand.

 

To all the little $% who complained... Thanks, now we get less info

 

 

Edit* to avoid multiple posts

 

If you don't want to engage because you might get killed, you're playing the wrong game.

I would like to respectfully point out that this post is not helping the conversation, and might actually be considered harmful by some.

You say I shouldnt play if I don't want to die... Really it's that I use logic to disagree wih you... Then you pretend youre being "respectful" when in reality you"re trying to get me in trouble.

 

I'll gladly take my first warning to say you're a child, Grow up.

Edited by Ziz

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And when you have no way to combat focus fire it means no one ever wants to engage and start a fight so you have hour long stand offs... Great idea mate

 

If you don't want to engage because you might get killed, you're playing the wrong game.

 

 

JTC I completely understand.

 

To all the little $% who complained... Thanks, now we get less info

I would like to respectfully point out that this post is not helping the conversation, and might actually be considered harmful by some.


I'm in this for the Experience, not the XP.

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"If we find it is too difficult to play ranged, we have a few systems we may need to add or augment, like ‘sticky’ targets, ranged assist or some manner of soft locking system. We aren’t quite sure what the right mix will be yet, but we feel comfortable that we’ll eventually find a solution that works well."

 

Just no to this if your missing with ranged when your targeting them lead them instead! Vary the aoe range of some of the spells, the speed etc etc.

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"If we find it is too difficult to play ranged, we have a few systems we may need to add or augment, like ‘sticky’ targets, ranged assist or some manner of soft locking system. We aren’t quite sure what the right mix will be yet, but we feel comfortable that we’ll eventually find a solution that works well."

 

Just no to this if your missing with ranged when your targeting them lead them instead! Vary the aoe range of some of the spells, the speed etc etc.

As a melee player I would usually say "make ranged harder it's easy mode!"

 

BUT... With latency and lag that can be unpredictable it's not always about skill but chance. Ideally a point and shoot system would be great but if it's not fun to play then what's the point?

Edited by Ziz

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Condemnation. This power, similar to Knight’s Block, is a combination of a hold and a channeled power. As long as the Confessor is depressing the key, she fires a flamethrower-esque cone of fire directly in front of her. This cone pulses every second and extends 15 meters.  And remember, like a flame thrower, she can re-target this thing as she is using it. It deals extra damage to any targets with Sin on them. Condemnation doesn’t remove Sin stacks, it just punishes those sinners more.

 

Literal fire hose.


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"If we find it is too difficult to play ranged, we have a few systems we may need to add or augment, like ‘sticky’ targets, ranged assist or some manner of soft locking system. We aren’t quite sure what the right mix will be yet, but we feel comfortable that we’ll eventually find a solution that works well."

 

Please don't jump to this too quickly... get a large group of testers in before you determine if it is too difficult.  I honestly believe modern gamers are pretty decent at aiming... and that yes it should be harder to aim vs people who know how to make themselves hard to hit through moving and utilizing movement abilities correctly. 

 

Edit:  Also when you add aim assistance type stuff you start feeling like a hybrid action combat game, not a true action combat game, and it's a very quick turnoff for a lot of pvpers.  That's why GW2 never developed a very strong pvp scene, it actually has a negative impact on a gamer's mentality when he is teased with action combat and it is taken away with aim assistance. 

 

I'm fairly confident that some type of aim assist function will be required to keep ranged attacks viable.  This isn't a twitch FPS and latency / net code issues impact ranged far more than melee or area of effect attacks.

 

As you ask for the developers patience in not "jumping too quickly" we need to be patient in actually testing the systems they have in game to see if its enough or too much.


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They should go back and change the specific (even if they are changing) and just use words like instant, short sun, medium stun, etc.  3 pages of relies could already be reduced to less than 1.

 

Does it look like Hellfire chain b would be compounding, say you want to wait until 18 sec have passed for the next 15 sec chain piece?  Or you looking at a window for that as well?

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I'm fairly confident that some type of aim assist function will be required to keep ranged attacks viable.  This isn't a twitch FPS and latency / net code issues impact ranged far more than melee or area of effect attacks.

 

As you ask for the developers patience in not "jumping too quickly" we need to be patient in actually testing the systems they have in game to see if its enough or too much.

I think twitch is used way too liberally these days... and that net code issues don't justify bad features, if the game has net code issues it should fix those net code issues, not put a bandaid on them.


Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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I'm fairly confident that some type of aim assist function will be required to keep ranged attacks viable.  This isn't a twitch FPS and latency / net code issues impact ranged far more than melee or area of effect attacks.

 

As you ask for the developers patience in not "jumping too quickly" we need to be patient in actually testing the systems they have in game to see if its enough or too much.

Have you played an MMO that didn't have aim assist with reticle targeting?  I have and it can be viable, regardless of latency/net code.  Your determination that this isn't a "twitch FPS" precludes the ability for it to be an MMO with twitch"ish" skills.  So, as you tell someone to be patient before making assumptions... I agree, and believe that we all should take that sage advice.

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If we find it is too difficult to play ranged, we have a few systems we may need to add or augment, like ‘sticky’ targets, ranged assist or some manner of soft locking system

 

I don't understand why people are reading this and seeing undodgeable homing missiles coupled with tab targeting.

 

In fact, I don't understand how anyone other than the developers know what the developers specifically mean when they say this.

 

You can make an educated guess but so far the guesses are nothing more than mad rambling.

Edited by Siegnir

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