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courant101

Testing Is Coming

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Some are getting too caught up in semantics. Testing of any kind starts End of Summer. It will start with the small group 25 or so of the highest backers then other will be added as needed based on backing level. There is no NDA so we will see footage when it begins.

 

Agreed, semantics isn't really important in this case.  :P

 

So, when do you guys think that the tests will begin?

Edited by courant101

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It's Alpha at the end of the summer, which includes pre-alpha group and possibly, when needed, alpha 1 testers.

Pre-alpha access grants you access to pre-alpha before the game enters alpha.... the game will be in pre-alpha... not alpha...

 

Edit:  It's also not an issue of semantics... it's about where the game is in its development... you wouldn't call a pre-alpha an alpha, or an open beta...  Stating what stage a game is in incorrectly can create certain expectations and letdowns...

Edited by VIKINGNAIL

Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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Pre-alpha access grants you access to pre-alpha before the game enters alpha.... the game will be in pre-alpha... not alpha...

 

Edit:  It's also not an issue of semantics... it's about where the game is in its development... you wouldn't call a pre-alpha an alpha, or an open beta...  Stating what stage a game is in incorrectly can create certain expectations and letdowns...

 

I understand your concerns about the pre-alpha customers who received the early access reward.

 

However I think it is not really a problem because ACE can just let them get in a couple days in advance, then announce the Alpha tests. It would still work with the previous Alpha information :

 

"Alpha testing for certain features of the core module will begin at the end of Summer, 2015. We expect to be testing new features and content on a quarterly basis." https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/crowfall/crowfall-throne-war-pc-mmo/description

 

"To be clear: at this point, nothing has changed. When we said "alpha testing for certain features of the core module will begin at the end of summer, 2015", that was as accurate as we could be (and still can be.) In terms of "who", i.e. how many people, from which alpha group(s), and how quickly will they be let in, the honest answer is: we don't know at this point. We can't know. 

The pre-alpha group is quite small (less than 25 folks) so we will likely have to dip very quickly into the next group to get enough people to test... But we won't know how quickly until we get there."  http://community.crowfall.com/index.php?/topic/7031-founders-update-under-the-surface-official-discussion-thread/?p=186720

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I understand your concerns about the pre-alpha customers who received the early access reward.

 

However I think it is not really a problem because ACE can just let them get in a couple days in advance, then announce the Alpha tests. It would still work with the previous Alpha information :

 

"Alpha testing for certain features of the core module will begin at the end of Summer, 2015. We expect to be testing new features and content on a quarterly basis." https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/crowfall/crowfall-throne-war-pc-mmo/description

 

"To be clear: at this point, nothing has changed. When we said "alpha testing for certain features of the core module will begin at the end of summer, 2015", that was as accurate as we could be (and still can be.) In terms of "who", i.e. how many people, from which alpha group(s), and how quickly will they be let in, the honest answer is: we don't know at this point. We can't know. 

The pre-alpha group is quite small (less than 25 folks) so we will likely have to dip very quickly into the next group to get enough people to test... But we won't know how quickly until we get there."  http://community.crowfall.com/index.php?/topic/7031-founders-update-under-the-surface-official-discussion-thread/?p=186720

I think people would be kinda perturbed if they paid so much for pre-alpha access and then ended up only getting in a couple days before alpha 1 access people...

 

As i said earlier in the thread, i've seen them use pre-alpha and alpha a lot... I do not believe the game will enter alpha stage at the end of summer... I believe it will be in pre-alpha testing...

 

As the kickstarter rewards specifically list for those who paid the right amount "access to pre-alpha testing"....

Edited by VIKINGNAIL

Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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I think people would be kinda perturbed if they paid so much for pre-alpha access and then ended up only getting in a couple days before alpha 1 access people...

 

As i said earlier in the thread, i've seen them use pre-alpha and alpha a lot... I do not believe the game will enter alpha stage at the end of summer... I believe it will be in pre-alpha testing...

 

It's hard to know if those people pledged specifically to get in earlier testing, but in my opinion it is not the case for any of them. The $5,000+ pledges contained a multitude of rewards.

 

Being able to enter the game before anyone else is worth the money anyway I believe.

Edited by courant101

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It's hard to know if those people pledged specifically to get in earlier testing, but in my opinion it is not the case for any of them. The $5,000+ pledges contained a multitude of rewards.

 

Being able to enter the game before anyone else is worth the money anyway I believe.

Sure... but if the kickstarter specifically says one of the perks at their pledge level is pre-alpha testing... then they'll be entering at a pre-alpha testing stage at the latest...

 

Though after seeing some of the way they've worded the kickstarter in general I could see some potential issues...

 

Landmark itself ran in to trouble because they worded something about beta starting by a certain point and then basically had to name their alpha a beta after a while for legal reasons... even though the game with really still in a very early alpha state. 

Edited by VIKINGNAIL

Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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Sure... but if the kickstarter specifically says one of the perks at their pledge level is pre-alpha testing... then they'll be entering at a pre-alpha testing stage at the latest...

 

Though after seeing some of the way they've worded the kickstarter in general I could see some potential issues...

 

Landmark itself ran in to trouble because they worded something about beta starting by a certain point and then basically had to name their alpha a beta after a while for legal reasons... even though the game with really still in a very early alpha state. 

 

As the kickstarter rewards specifically list for those who paid the right amount "access to pre-alpha testing"....

 

We are in edit : pre-alpha testing phase currently as purplestreak wrote and we are in summer, so when the pre-alpha testers enter the game it could technically still be pre-alpha until they announce alpha. But yet again, as pang mentioned, the problem may be more about semantics than anything else.

Edited by courant101

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We are in pre-alpha testing currently as purplestreak wrote and we are in summer, so when the pre-alpha testers enter the game it could technically still be pre-alpha until they announce alpha. But yet again, as pang mentioned, the problem may be more about semantics than anything else.

 

As I mentioned earlier it's more about what stage of testing they are actually in... if the game is in a pre-alpha state it would be silly to call it alpha, or beta or anything else...


Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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It's hard to know if those people pledged specifically to get in earlier testing, but in my opinion it is not the case for any of them. The $5,000+ pledges contained a multitude of rewards.

 

Being able to enter the game before anyone else is worth the money anyway I believe.

 

The game is in a pre-alpha state, but pre-alpha testing hasn't started. That won't officially happen until the combat test. This also why I have a hard time seeing any Alpha build testing soon after the combat test since they will likely iterate on that.

Edited by purplestreak

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I think people would be kinda perturbed if they paid so much for pre-alpha access and then ended up only getting in a couple days before alpha 1 access people...

 

As i said earlier in the thread, i've seen them use pre-alpha and alpha a lot... I do not believe the game will enter alpha stage at the end of summer... I believe it will be in pre-alpha testing...

 

As the kickstarter rewards specifically list for those who paid the right amount "access to pre-alpha testing"....

 

I think it notable that ACE is NOT descriping the testing as either "Pre Alpha" or "Alpha" in their Road to Combat Testing.  This feels pretty common in this era of game development (reference Star Citizen's Dogfight Module, FPS module, etc) with more transparency with earlier access to limited systems that are built up over time.

 

As a reminder in regards to timing and priority of testers, to quote:

The basic framework is pretty simple. We'll start with pre-alpha testers at the end of summer, then move on to the Alpha 1 group, drawing people in as the system allows/as necessary in order to get the data we need. Players will use their account login (the same one used on crowfall.com to access pledge rewards and the forums.)

 

 

It's hard to know if those people pledged specifically to get in earlier testing, but in my opinion it is not the case for any of them. The $5,000+ pledges contained a multitude of rewards.

 

Being able to enter the game before anyone else is worth the money anyway I believe.

 

I think the "Pre Alpha" Testers absolutely DO need to be the first ones in since that is one of the incentives to their pledge.  But we know ACE will pull in additional testers as needed.  So that might mean a couple days or weeks later (*fingers crossed*) or it might mean not at all until the next milestone.

Edited by ren

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As I mentioned earlier it's more about what stage of testing they are actually in... if the game is in a pre-alpha state it would be silly to call it alpha, or beta or anything else...

 

I think that there's no consensus in the video game industry about how to clearly define phases of development.

 

There was an interesting post by ACE discussing this subject :

 

"No reason to be concerned.  I've probably worked for more game companies than anyone you've ever met (and have done due diligence on many times that number of teams), and in my experience it's rare for production terms such as Alpha and Beta to have the same definition from company to company or even studio to studio.

For example, your specific definition of Pre-Alpha I've never personally seen used.  I've promised to lay out some of our development processes in the Team Updates so expect to see more about this in those every-other Wednesday updates over the coming months.  We actually aren't setting our definition of Alpha firmly until we move from a pre-production state into full production.  And in my management process those definitions are codified in conjunction with the team that executes against them, so ours aren't actually set yet!" http://community.crowfall.com/index.php?/topic/1695-ask-the-team/?p=45983

 

 

I think the "Pre Alpha" Testers absolutely DO need to be the first ones in since that is one of the incentives to their pledge.  But we know ACE will pull in additional testers as needed.  So that might mean a couple days or weeks later (*fingers crossed*) or it might mean not at all until the next milestone.

 

Yes I totally agree with this, they obtained an early access reward and I believe it has to be honoured. The question I believe was more about how long they should have the exclusivity ("pre-alpha") before the game is announced to be in Alpha.

 

 

The game is in a pre-alpha state, but pre-alpha testing hasn't started. That won't officially happen until the combat test. This also why I have a hard time seeing any Alpha build testing soon after the combat test since they will likely iterate on that.

 

That seems correct, however I expect the game to enter the Alpha stage as soon as some testers of the Alpha 1 group gets in it, which could be as soon as late summer from my understanding.

 

edit : thanks for correcting the pre-alpha testing / phase confusion  :)

Edited by courant101

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Pre-alpha means before alpha.

 

Technically ACE can say Pre-Alpha testers get in 1 hour or even 10 minutes before alpha starts, then after that they can let other users in. ACE would still be upholding their end of the deal because nowhere in the pledge did they say how long they would be in pre-alpha stages for testing. And if someone payed for that pledge level just for pre-alpha and they dont care about the other stuff, then it sucks to be them.

 

Now knowing ACE they will probably put some time in for pre-alpha testers but it will probably be short if there are only 25 people in it (maybe a couple days), because 25 people can not test the full functionality of the game in any reasonable time frame.

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