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First of all, its been a while since i posted, or read anything on the forums, appologies for that  :D So due to that im not sure if this has been suggested before.

 

I was watching the Crowfall – Combat Strike Team, Milestone 1 video and its good to see this progression and how its done (thumbs up) but as i was watching, and as i kept hearing about physics i couldn't but help noticing something. If you use a ranged skill and it hits something, the skill actually hits.

 

Then i saw the team vs team bit at 21 minutes into the video and i saw folks ravaging eachother and i thought, you folks doing so much work on getting the physics right, which is awsome! But there should be a bit of reality in there aswell. If i swing my sword at my enemy, and my partner in crime is in front of me, technicly, i should hit him, and not my enemy. Aka friendly fire. Is it perhaps an idea, to implement this, because you all doing a great job on the physics, a bit of logics and reallity should be in place aswell, not sure if its hard to implemend or anything. 

 

I think it would make the game more interesting, and it would make people be more aware of what they would, or would not do. It i think would prevent things like zergs becaus they would simply kill eachother. (Ofcourse you will get team killers aswell) but hopefully over time that will pass, or a jail system perhaps (archeage).

 

But anyway you folks got any thought about friendly fire?

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Friendly fire has been confirmed for a while now.  It is not functioning for the pre-alpha build that was displayed in the video though.  The only ruleset band that has friendly fire confirmed to be turned off is the 3 faction (God's Reach).

 

Hope this helps.

Edited by destrin

"Float like a Butterfly.... Sting like a Misplaced Decimal Point" - Xarrayne 2018

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https://crowfall.com/#/faq/physics

 

Many tech support systems have a mechanism which will search a knowledge base for relevant content before you can submit a ticket. I think it would be awesome if a similar system here would perform a quick scan of the FAQ before creating a new suggestion thread.

Official "Bad Person" of Crowfall

"I think 1/3rd of my postcount is telling people that we aren't turning into a PvE / casual / broad audience game." -

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Friendly fire has been confirmed for a while now.  It is not functioning for the pre-alpha build that was displayed in the video though.  The only ruleset band that has friendly fire confirmed to be turned off is the 3 faction (God's Reach).

 

Hope this helps.

However it is something than can show up as turned off in any ring.

 

People need to stop thinking rules are tied to rings, most rules outside of the factions available/alliances available are able to be swung to any ring. That's the joy of Crowfall.

"Lawful Good does not always mean Lawful Nice."

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From the alpha footage so far though it looks like the ranged classes will just be nuking their own teamates. Unless maybe they add in trajectory (which they said they wouldn't) it looks like it is going to need to be carefully monitored.

That's the point, ranged players will have to play much more carefully or their own people will simply kill them over and over again till they learnt o knock off the aoe spam.

Melee will have it really bad in the dog packs that happen in any PvP game. Those frontal cone aoes will overlap like crazy and half the damage you take could easily be your buddy next to you.

"Lawful Good does not always mean Lawful Nice."

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From the alpha footage so far though it looks like the ranged classes will just be nuking their own teamates. Unless maybe they add in trajectory (which they said they wouldn't) it looks like it is going to need to be carefully monitored.

 

I hadn't heard this.  So this means when friendly fire is turned on, I won't be able to lead targets with spells?  That's preposterous.

 

Edit: If I'm understanding you correctly, this will severely nerf ranged classes, and lower the skill required to play one.  That makes me sad.  Adios Confessor, unless you have a confessor only attack group.  Weak.

Edited by Karma LoD
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With the current combat mechanics and friendly fire melee will be screwed in any kind of group fight with all the cleaves and straight line ranged attacks. If FF happens there needs to be different attack trajectories for melee and ranged. Ranged needs a projectile that can arc over friendly melee and melee characters need an over head downward swing or forward stab as a narrow line attack. These attacks will require more skill to land but with a good team it will be possible to attain target convergence without murdering your own bros.

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With the current combat mechanics and friendly fire melee will be screwed in any kind of group fight with all the cleaves and straight line ranged attacks. If FF happens there needs to be different attack trajectories for melee and ranged. Ranged needs a projectile that can arc over friendly melee and melee characters need an over head downward swing or forward stab as a narrow line attack. These attacks will require more skill to land but with a good team it will be possible to attain target convergence without murdering your own bros.

They won't be screwed, they just have to play better and more consciously....

Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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Was just going to echo draeden and say that with the current array of abilities, FF would be a nightmare.

 

It`s simple; I won`t be playing this game - if they remove FF in the shadows & the dregs rulesets, and I will email a refund based on the CW`s advertisement related to campaigns. They need to fix the issues in combat and adapt it to both environments with and without FF.
Edited by mythx

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Crowfall Game Client: https://www.crowfall.com/en/client/

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  • 3 weeks later...

I hadn't heard this.  So this means when friendly fire is turned on, I won't be able to lead targets with spells?  That's preposterous.

 

Edit: If I'm understanding you correctly, this will severely nerf ranged classes, and lower the skill required to play one.  That makes me sad.  Adios Confessor, unless you have a confessor only attack group.  Weak.

Yeah because when has any one in any game with projectile-physics magic ever actually used aoe or splash-damage magic in real combat?

 

Oh wait-

 

https://youtu.be/s5wLuLvhlZU?t=392

aka honeybear

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I wouldn't be surprised if friendly fire gets scraped, if not scraped than watered down a whole lot. A few things have to change in combat currently for FF to work well.

 

A large majority of the confessors abilities are aoe, even the basic attacks last chain is aoe. We haven't seen what a true long range caster will look or function like in combat (confessor is more of a medium range character). Even right now, with the way animation lock works, it's extremely hard not to smack your teammates with spells/attacks.

 

I dare anyone to show me a good example of animation lock aim oriented heavy games with FF working together well. FF works great in DFO but guess what? There is a TON of mobility in that game and virtually no animation lock. FF works great in run and gun games, but no so much in "stand still and execute your attack" games. I

Edited by helix
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  • 2 weeks later...

I wouldn't be surprised if friendly fire gets scraped, if not scraped than watered down a whole lot. A few things have to change in combat currently for FF to work well.

 

A large majority of the confessors abilities are aoe, even the basic attacks last chain is aoe. We haven't seen what a true long range caster will look or function like in combat (confessor is more of a medium range character). Even right now, with the way animation lock works, it's extremely hard not to smack your teammates with spells/attacks.

 

I dare anyone to show me a good example of animation lock aim oriented heavy games with FF working together well. FF works great in DFO but guess what? There is a TON of mobility in that game and virtually no animation lock. FF works great in run and gun games, but no so much in "stand still and execute your attack" games. I

If they're smart, they'll scrap "stand still and execute your attack" LONG before they scrap friendly fire.

 

Thats by far the biggest concern I had watching combat. Go watch the centaur try and sticky-back anyone. Every time he makes a melee move, for some custard reason, his character stops running so he can take a swing. This means that anyone with ping of >80 will never be able to melee in this game because they'll never be able to connect, much less stickyback someone. These devs need to get rid of whatever mechanism stops character movement - even if they keep the animation so the centaur "slides" as he is meleeing it would be a thousand times better than the current mechanic.

 

Its still alpha so theres plenty of time to fix this though.

aka honeybear

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I don't really understand the logic behind friendly fire struggling with animation locking... if you, your allies and your enemies all have readable actions than its natural to assume that is harder to make mistakes.

 

Inversely, if you, your allies and your enemies are all swirling around each other trying to avoid attacks, than yeah, accidents will happen. In fact, reducing all mobility and making fast movement carry proper inertia so you can't disperse momentum easily would make it even harder to hit the wrong target...

 

I was hoping for a more strategic game, if they can't implement arc fire, than friendly fire is going to collide with larger scale battle, along with all this erratic dodge reliance for defense, and create a very shallow battlefield experience.

 

But hey, that's just a theory, a... never mind.

Edited by bahamutkaiser

a52d4a0d-044f-44ff-8a10-ccc31bfa2d87.jpg          Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes... Than if they're upset, they'll be a mile away, and barefoot :P

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I don't really understand the logic behind friendly fire struggling with animation locking... if you, your allies and your enemies all have readable actions than its natural to assume that is harder to make mistakes.

Inversely, if you, your allies and your enemies are all swirling around each other trying to avoid attacks, than yeah, accidents will happen. In fact, reducing all mobility and making fast movement carry proper inertia so you can't disperse momentum easily would make it even harder to hit the wrong target...

I was hoping for a more strategic game, if they can't implement arc fire, than friendly fire is going to collide with larger scale battle, along with all this erratic dodge reliance for defense, and create a very shallow battlefield experience.

But hey, that's just a theory, a... never mind.

Good players / teams / clans will know how to manage groups and armies with friendly fire and will dominate bad ones. Again - in darkfall, good players outnumbered in tight places expecting to go down would sometimes intentionally melee rush their pursuers. If they were outnumbered by bad players or noobs, everyone would get excited that they were about to kill someone "skilled" so they'd all try to melee him at once - and they would all do ten times the damage to each other as they did to him. Sometimes it was so bad one player could weave in and out of these mosh pits and wipe the group by using their friendly fire against them.

 

Fast pace games with friendly fire don't make for dull combat or hollow strategy, they just show you the good players from the bad.

aka honeybear

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Good players / teams / clans will know how to manage groups and armies with friendly fire and will dominate bad ones. Again - in darkfall, good players outnumbered in tight places expecting to go down would sometimes intentionally melee rush their pursuers. If they were outnumbered by bad players or noobs, everyone would get excited that they were about to kill someone "skilled" so they'd all try to melee him at once - and they would all do ten times the damage to each other as they did to him. Sometimes it was so bad one player could weave in and out of these mosh pits and wipe the group by using their friendly fire against them.

 

Fast pace games with friendly fire don't make for dull combat or hollow strategy, they just show you the good players from the bad.

Friendly fire only provides problems for players who can't control how they use and coordinate their abilities, that's always been the case. 

Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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Sometimes it was so bad one player could weave in and out of these mosh pits and wipe the group by using their friendly fire against them.

That sounds absolutely hilarious.

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